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End The Curse
 Post subject: The New System
PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:53 am 
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Ryan Miller was very emphatic after last night's game about the difference in the new system in place this year, and how the players have embraced it. This system stresses puck possession and having one others back, skating harder, being more physical, etc. but besides a change in attitude what does it technically mean?

As I see it, the Sabres are rotating the defense up into the neutral zone more aggressively to gain an advantage at the point of attack, allowing us to pick off more passes, block rushes before they start, and help to outnumber the opposition for loose pucks and gain greater possession time in the offensive zone. To prevent odd-man rushes, the forwards are conscious about filling in any defensive gaps when the d-men carry the puck up ice and into the opponent's zone.

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Jim Bob
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2009 12:30 pm 
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Maybe it's just me, but I don't see this as Ruff changing "his system" as much as he's learned new ways to sell it to the players ("Hey, it works for Detroit, guys!") and he's learned new practice drills to help hone things in.

Ruff has been harping on things like getting in on the forecheck, back pressure and defensive responsibility, the defense being active and getting into the attack, and a bunch of other "puck possession system" things for years.

I just hope this team has matured to the point that the players play the system 65+ nights this year and on average for more than 20 minutes per game.

The issue with this team the past two seasons hasn't been Ruff's system. It has been getting the players to play Ruff's system on a more consistent basis.

It's been great that they have stuck with it for 4 games.

Now let's see what things look like after 20, 40, and 60 games........

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TRBirdman
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2009 12:47 pm 
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And I heard something about not carrying the puck as much, but more emphasis on quick passes, tape to tape.


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PuckSniperPensel
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2009 12:54 pm 
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Jim Bob wrote:
Maybe it's just me, but I don't see this as Ruff changing "his system" as much as he's learned new ways to sell it to the players ("Hey, it works for Detroit, guys!") and he's learned new practice drills to help hone things in.

Ruff has been harping on things like getting in on the forecheck, back pressure and defensive responsibility, the defense being active and getting into the attack, and a bunch of other "puck possession system" things for years.

I just hope this team has matured to the point that the players play the system 65+ nights this year and on average for more than 20 minutes per game.

The issue with this team the past two seasons hasn't been Ruff's system. It has been getting the players to play Ruff's system on a more consistent basis.

It's been great that they have stuck with it for 4 games.

Now let's see what things look like after 20, 40, and 60 games........



With all due respect, this year's system is much different than the past 2.

In a nut shell, we played the trap the past 2 years. It was a box and 1 formation; 1 forechecker, with the rest of the team sitting back in the neutral zone trying to force the other team to the outside wall.

The problem is, we had a small team with no grit. How can you expect guys like Derek Roy and Tim Connolly to be enthused about throwing hits on much larger players in the neutral zone?

You can't.

This year, we aren't sitting back in a trap formation. Ruff is utilizing the speed and agility of our roster to pressure the puck carriers from all sides and force them to make quick decisions, resulting in turn overs.

It's much, much easier to get players motivated when you play to their strengths instead of their weaknesses.

As an example. Watch when the other team comes out from behind their own net with the puck. 2 forwards pressure and funnel him towards the half wall, while the other forward sits near the blue line at center ice, taking away the passing option, and looking for a giveaway that would set up an odd man rush.

Another example. When we lose the puck in the offensive zone on the cycle, and the other team sends the puck up the wall, the defenseman on that side pinches. His parter swings across to cover behind him, and the winger on the opposite side of the puck drops his head and skates towards the neutral zone to prevent a 2 or 3 on one.

If the defenseman successfully makes the pinch, the Center drops behind the net for a pass and the near side winger drives to the slot.

It's created a ton of goals, and when I get my computer telestrator set up, I'll load the videos on youtube and show you what I'm talking about. It's pretty cool.

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AudSabres
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2009 12:58 pm 
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The D jumpin into the play last night was amazing to see. Butler and Myers playing on the PP, and then Myers running like a freight train to the net! The kid doesn't look lanky out there at all and a few strides and he's at top speed! I loved it when he wound up at the point and "faked" a shot. The Wing's forward just kinda stood there like a statue praying it wouldn't hit him, lol.

If it's a new system, or the old one just explained in a different language the players understand, I don't give a damn. It's working so far. I'll say this though, if you can out play a team like the Wing's in the puck posession dept. then you're doing something right and you'll win games. Grinding in the corners, coming out with the puck and not being afraid to rush the net. It's been working. They just need to keep it up!

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Hammygoodness
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2009 2:48 pm 
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PuckSniperPensel wrote:
It's created a ton of goals, and when I get my computer telestrator set up, I'll load the videos on youtube and show you what I'm talking about. It's pretty cool.

You... you have a telestrator? Awesome like possum.

Ham

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PuckSniperPensel
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2009 2:51 pm 
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Hammygoodness wrote:
PuckSniperPensel wrote:
It's created a ton of goals, and when I get my computer telestrator set up, I'll load the videos on youtube and show you what I'm talking about. It's pretty cool.

You... you have a telestrator? Awesome like possum.

Ham


I do! Haha. I coach a varsity soccer team, and I use it to go over game tapes with them.

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Skyline_BNR34
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2009 3:41 pm 
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Ruff has also learned from his Team Canadian coaches on what and how to make it work better.

Being an assistant understand Babcock, you're going to take ideas from him, and he will use different systems of play for certain teams.

I read it on the article on NHL.com about it.

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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
No need for violence, just tell her she's got a game misconduct and show her the door.

Rud wrote:
As I said in the GDT, the call on Rivet was horseshit. The Bruins player was holding onto Rivet's stick like it was the last fucking raft on the Titanic.


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Jim Bob
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 9:34 am 
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PuckSniperPensel wrote:
With all due respect, this year's system is much different than the past 2.

In a nut shell, we played the trap the past 2 years. It was a box and 1 formation; 1 forechecker, with the rest of the team sitting back in the neutral zone trying to force the other team to the outside wall.

The problem is, we had a small team with no grit. How can you expect guys like Derek Roy and Tim Connolly to be enthused about throwing hits on much larger players in the neutral zone?

You can't.

This year, we aren't sitting back in a trap formation. Ruff is utilizing the speed and agility of our roster to pressure the puck carriers from all sides and force them to make quick decisions, resulting in turn overs.

It's much, much easier to get players motivated when you play to their strengths instead of their weaknesses.

As an example. Watch when the other team comes out from behind their own net with the puck. 2 forwards pressure and funnel him towards the half wall, while the other forward sits near the blue line at center ice, taking away the passing option, and looking for a giveaway that would set up an odd man rush.

Another example. When we lose the puck in the offensive zone on the cycle, and the other team sends the puck up the wall, the defenseman on that side pinches. His parter swings across to cover behind him, and the winger on the opposite side of the puck drops his head and skates towards the neutral zone to prevent a 2 or 3 on one.

If the defenseman successfully makes the pinch, the Center drops behind the net for a pass and the near side winger drives to the slot.

It's created a ton of goals, and when I get my computer telestrator set up, I'll load the videos on youtube and show you what I'm talking about. It's pretty cool.


There are a bunch of pieces to "this year's scheme" that have been there all along with Ruff:

- Wanting shorter, crisper passes
- Wanting shorter, harder shifts (If I had a nickle for every time Max & Vanek ended up in the dog house for extending shifts, I could buy the Sabres from BTG)
- Wanting the defense to be active and jump into the play
- Wanting them to get pucks to the paint and create ugly goals
- Wanting the team to take care of business in their own end first and create offense in the transition game

And the Sabres are still trapping this year when they get a lead.

Pretty much every team traps when they have a 3rd period lead.

Ruff may have tweaked a few things. But, I still think the bigger issue is that, for now, the players are actually listening and playing the game the way Ruff wants them to.

But, it's not like they haven't had streaks where they have listened and won over the past two seasons. The issue has been consistency in playing Ruff's game.

That will be the determining factor again this year.

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TRBirdman
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 9:48 am 
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I have a pet peeve to share, if you care . . .

Why does it matter whether goals are ugly? (I'm guessing that the rise of ESPN is to blame. I know, I sound old.) As long as the puck goes into the net, I couldn't care less how it got there.

I really appreciate you knowledgeable hockey gurus explaining the systems. Thank you. I played the game, only as a kid/teenager, and have a hard time seeing all this stuff.

Rant over. Carry on.


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mechaphil
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 10:59 am 
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TRBirdman wrote:
I have a pet peeve to share, if you care . . .

Why does it matter whether goals are ugly? (I'm guessing that the rise of ESPN is to blame. I know, I sound old.) As long as the puck goes into the net, I couldn't care less how it got there.

I really appreciate you knowledgeable hockey gurus explaining the systems. Thank you. I played the game, only as a kid/teenager, and have a hard time seeing all this stuff.

Rant over. Carry on.

I, too, love the ugly goal. Goose pounding home his own rebound while in the mush of Howard is the kinda goal I love to see :D

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Jim Bob
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 11:49 am 
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TRBirdman wrote:
I have a pet peeve to share, if you care . . .

Why does it matter whether goals are ugly? (I'm guessing that the rise of ESPN is to blame. I know, I sound old.) As long as the puck goes into the net, I couldn't care less how it got there.


Ugly goals aren't as fun as the highlight reel ones!

Any player would rather dangle forehand, backhand, top corner for a goal as opposed to banging in a rebound from 2 feet out.

Ruff has been trying to drill into their heads that they need to keep making the fundamentally sound play of getting the puck to the net early and often as opposed to trying to dangle too much or make the extra, pretty pass.

Vanek might have gotten yelled at for trying to make the pass to Stafford had Lidstrom not deflected the pass in, for instance.

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Skyline_BNR34
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 4:43 pm 
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Jim Bob wrote:
TRBirdman wrote:
I have a pet peeve to share, if you care . . .

Why does it matter whether goals are ugly? (I'm guessing that the rise of ESPN is to blame. I know, I sound old.) As long as the puck goes into the net, I couldn't care less how it got there.


Ugly goals aren't as fun as the highlight reel ones!

Any player would rather dangle forehand, backhand, top corner for a goal as opposed to banging in a rebound from 2 feet out.

Ruff has been trying to drill into their heads that they need to keep making the fundamentally sound play of getting the puck to the net early and often as opposed to trying to dangle too much or make the extra, pretty pass.

Vanek might have gotten yelled at for trying to make the pass to Stafford had Lidstrom not deflected the pass in, for instance.

Vanek was making that play happen, if it hadn't gone in, I don't think it would have mattered because it would have been one hell of a chance for a goal anyways.

And who says Vanek can't pass a puck, well I guess he can't, it went into the net instead. :lol:

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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
No need for violence, just tell her she's got a game misconduct and show her the door.

Rud wrote:
As I said in the GDT, the call on Rivet was horseshit. The Bruins player was holding onto Rivet's stick like it was the last fucking raft on the Titanic.


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icehound
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 4:53 pm 
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Unfortunately, more often than not, Thomas is guilty of the soft or whiffed pass that ends up being intercepted. He just is.

I have yet to see crisp "tape-to-tape" passes come off his stick. Finesse is one thing, a seeming indecisiveness is another.

Butch up those wrists, Tommy. Put a bit of snap into those passes.


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Skyline_BNR34
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 5:59 pm 
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icehound wrote:
Unfortunately, more often than not, Thomas is guilty of the soft or whiffed pass that ends up being intercepted. He just is.

I have yet to see crisp "tape-to-tape" passes come off his stick. Finesse is one thing, a seeming indecisiveness is another.

Butch up those wrists, Tommy. Put a bit of snap into those passes.

That one goal was sure crisp and right to where he wanted it to be. Stafford would have had an easy goal if it hadn't hit Lidstrom, but that is also a whole different story.

He keeps that up, then maybe he'll have way more assist numbers. I also think a reason he didn't have many high assist numbers through the last few years has been the result of him always getting fed the puck, since Roy and Max were puck-hogs.

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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
No need for violence, just tell her she's got a game misconduct and show her the door.

Rud wrote:
As I said in the GDT, the call on Rivet was horseshit. The Bruins player was holding onto Rivet's stick like it was the last fucking raft on the Titanic.


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Van_Da_Man
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 7:51 pm 
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Skyline_BNR34 wrote:
Jim Bob wrote:
TRBirdman wrote:
I have a pet peeve to share, if you care . . .

Why does it matter whether goals are ugly? (I'm guessing that the rise of ESPN is to blame. I know, I sound old.) As long as the puck goes into the net, I couldn't care less how it got there.


Ugly goals aren't as fun as the highlight reel ones!

Any player would rather dangle forehand, backhand, top corner for a goal as opposed to banging in a rebound from 2 feet out.

Ruff has been trying to drill into their heads that they need to keep making the fundamentally sound play of getting the puck to the net early and often as opposed to trying to dangle too much or make the extra, pretty pass.

Vanek might have gotten yelled at for trying to make the pass to Stafford had Lidstrom not deflected the pass in, for instance.

Vanek was making that play happen, if it hadn't gone in, I don't think it would have mattered because it would have been one hell of a chance for a goal anyways.

And who says Vanek can't pass a puck, well I guess he can't, it went into the net instead. :lol:


He only had one shooting "goal" :lol: Lidstrom must be kicking himself for that one. I'd be like 'Omgz did I score?' :dance:

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SabresKings2624
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 12:49 am 
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I'm loving the new(er) system. We just need to keep playing it all season long.

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BS1970
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:49 am 
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I like how we have 4 scoring lines again.

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patkane88
 Post subject: Re: The New System
PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:58 am 
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I listen to this show called hockey central at noon on thursday and Ruff was on the show and he said when he was at the Canadian Olympic camp, he was keep tabs on Ken Hitchcock and Mike Babcock and he modified his system with their styles the use.

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