OMG...it takes a LOT more than THAT to offend me. I'm married to an Italian!

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Its NNYFAN, but you can just call me Kris.

Not in the least, Its no doubt that people who are Christian have their choices influenced by what they believe, in fact that goes for anyone, if you believe something you are more inclined to go for a decision that goes along with what you believe

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LETS GO BUFFALO!

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"Go out and run 'em."
- Lindy Ruff, 23 Feb. 2007

I guess there must be more than one kind of absolute, total equality then. If everyone is equal, then certainly we should all receive treatment when we are sick? It's just a basic of human nature to help someone who is ill. Right now there is no way that a large portion of the population who live at or below poverty can afford health insurance, but the Republicans are voting against them every day. Maybe what you mean by "equal" is that they have an equal chance of getting insurance if they can afford it, or if they haven't had a history of being ill. Obviously the only short-term solution is to subsidize, but the Republicans will cry "raise taxes" as always. No one likes higher taxes, but short of ending stupid wars created for contractors there is no other way to raise the capital necessary.

On the flip-side, it is a bit obscene to see yourself working hard to EARN something that someone else will take for granted. I guess that's a separate issue, but this country needs universal health-care NOW, and we will have to figure out the details later; a work-in-progress thing.

I hope you don't view this as a personal attack. I liked some of your points. I'm just throwing in my 2 cents is all.

Well...no one in DC, including the most left Democrats or the President want universal health care.

No bill currently on the hill has universal health care.

In fact, the $1.2 trillion bill being discussed right now only raises the level of insured from 82% to 94%.

So we pass this massive legislation and we still have millions uninsured and broke.

Good fucking job Washington.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

Well I've been called ignorant before but.....

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Hold my beer and watch this...

Normally I like your posts Zilla, but that one left me scratching my head going "really?"

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

Bingo.

BTW, the GOP plan would provide a pool where those with preconditions could still receive health care benefits.

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Oh lord, it's hard to be humble, when you're perfect in every way. I can't wait to look in the mirror, 'cause I get better looking each day. To know me is to love me, I must be a hell of a man. Oh lord, it's hard to be humble, but I'm doin' the best that I can.

The Gilda Radner character, Emily I think, would go off on a misguided rant, misunderstanding or mishearing words and going off on a completely false tangent that was very funny. At the end, Chevy would correct her by whispering what was actually said, and she would stop, look sheepishly into the camera, and say "never mind".

Zilla is comparing the unintelligible rant of Rutlege to Emily, I'm guessing.

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Oh lord, it's hard to be humble, when you're perfect in every way. I can't wait to look in the mirror, 'cause I get better looking each day. To know me is to love me, I must be a hell of a man. Oh lord, it's hard to be humble, but I'm doin' the best that I can.

Its Rosanne Rosanna Danna. I love her. LOL

Regarding Universal Health care...two things come to mind.

First, in England, the Universal care was put in place just after WW2 when England was all but obliterated by Germany. It was put in place out of necessity and everyone hates it. Now England is stuck with it because its the #1 (or so) employer in England.

Second, its not FREE. We will all be paying for it with higher taxes.

Third, if its so friggen great, why won't Congress be using it? Can you say: Double standard?

Fourth, I like my insurance the way it is from my husband's employer. If someone is poor, there is Medicaid. For children, there is Child Health Plus. I believe there should be something put in place as an OPTION for people that don't have access to health care...such as maybe their employer doesn't offer it as a perk. Maybe they are self employed. An option for these people would be nice. But making it a blanket thing, making the government in charge of it, deciding for us what we are going to have done instead of our doctor is absurd.

Okay...back to the coffee pot!

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Its NNYFAN, but you can just call me Kris.

That seems mostly fair. I don't know that "the government will tell me what doctor to use" is really a valid argument though. Private providers have a list of Doctors/Dentists/whatever that they cover.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

I loved her, too, but that was a different character of Radner's. Emily was definitely the one in the above skit. Rosanna Danna had the big, frizzy hair while Emily was more the homely librarian type.

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Oh lord, it's hard to be humble, when you're perfect in every way. I can't wait to look in the mirror, 'cause I get better looking each day. To know me is to love me, I must be a hell of a man. Oh lord, it's hard to be humble, but I'm doin' the best that I can.

Sure it is.
If there's a public option, the government can't mandate that doctors participate.
Case in point: My current doctor kicks ass...he's part of a practicing group that accepts my insurance. If you're on Medicare however, you can't see my doctor...he doesn't take medicare patients.

That is, effectively, the government telling people what doctors they can and can't see.

The same situation would exist and be expanded unless the government forced doctors to accept patients on the public option.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

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"Go out and run 'em."
- Lindy Ruff, 23 Feb. 2007

Well, you kind of prove my point, that being that we have that problem already. I mean I guess if you want to argue that it could be compounded, I guess you might have something.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

How is that a problem?
I work hard to have a choice. I pay extra to have a PPO instead of a HMO plan.
If you're on a government program you have choice taken away....you get what you pay for.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

Xcheck, the reason most doctors do not participate with Medicaid/Medicare is because the government barely pays shit for services. If it was comparable to commercial insurers then more doctors would participate. Yes, the health care system definitely overcharges like crazy but that is because of our lovely world of litigation. THAT is what needs to be reformed.

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That's covered in the bill. $4 billion of it. That was hush money for the AMA.
The bill doesn't address tort reform at all.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

God's job is to pass judgement, not ours. Far too often, Christians are going too far to play God and pass judgment, and exhibiting the ultimate sin of PRIDE by attempting to know the will of God. All that does is completely shy non-believers away from experiencing the love of Christ.

I don't know if this is the appropriate place for this rant, but that's not going to stop me. You see it even on these boards, all the time. Christianity is not the extremists who hold the signs saying 'God hates fags'. Christianity is not a closed-minded group who hides behind their Bibles. It is a hard, long road where you have to be extremely open minded, and open hearted, and running towards a goal bigger than what this world has to offer.

As a board member, I do take offense to the constant swindling of my religion, and my choices, because that's the same persecution that as a Christian I face in the world every day. By persecuting and mocking Jesus over and over, you can chalk that up to you constantly berating my father over and over. No one takes nicely to that, and I don't either.

We can constantly make fun of religions for being 'crazy', and 'how could they EVER believe in some unseen force that the Church has just manipulated for control over the people!? I'm so sick of them forcing their opinions on me!', or we can see the absolute ignorant error in that. I don't recall ever trying to convert an atheist, so where is your battle for conversion to your non-belief stemming from? Why do people so wholeheartedly want to bring down something that gives people a sense of peace? Do you ever wonder where that sense of peace comes from, or tried to experience it in any of your tirades? It's much easier to make an opinion rather than trying to take steps to understand the one you oppose. I was an atheist, that didn't really work out.

I'm not going to apologize, or try and gloss over what has been said.

I'm a fan of love for everyone. Republicans and democrats, straights and gays, Christians and atheists. It's because of that love, that I've been able to find a perfect glove fit in my relationship with Jesus Christ. I just wish people could stop persecuting the Church and see that they're spreading around the same closed mindedness that they're so opposed to. It has really gotten old around here.

Personally I feel like most religions and ideologies work toward the same end. The messengers might differ but the message is often the same. I don't really feel like this is the place to go into it but that is my 2 cents.

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All the things we wanted each other to be we'll never be.