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All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
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Author:  Squanto [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:33 am ]
Post subject:  All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
After the initial form of the Publc Option was removed, and replaced with a plan to allow seniors to buy into Medicare at 55, it appear that even that plan is about to get tossed.

Holy Joe Lieberman has LONG supported the idea to allow 55-64 year olds to buy in to Medicare early. As recently as 3 months ago, he was talking that idea up.

But now that the chips are down, he says he'll join a filibuster of the health care bill if such a provision is included.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/12/14/health.care/index.html

Regardless of which side of the debate you're on, you have to admit that this is just garbage. Lieberman has pulled this nonsense for years, and I really hope that the people of Connecticut get this guy out of office as soon as they can.
Author:  End The Curse [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
To this, I say Fuck Ottawa.
Author:  Godzilla1960 [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
I can honestly say I hate Joe Lieberman. That lying, two-faced, whore-of-the-insurance industry could drop dead tomorrow and I would raise a beer in celebration.

As for the Democrats, if they can't pass some meaningful health care reform then I am done with them, politics, and voting. A party that can't achieve its stated goals when in control of the White House, the House, and with a 60 seat majority in the Senate has no reason to exist.

Didn't I tell you, Cross, that you had no need to fear Democratic control of both houses of Congress and the White House? What a bunch of spineless bunglers.
Author:  daz28 [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 1:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
meh, there isn't gonna be any money for any of these programs anyways. While every state(48 I think) is scrambling to pay their heating bill, the fed. gov't thinks they still have a platinum card. Retards.

In layman's terms; Let's fight with the wife about the size of the new LCD tv WE AREN'T GOING TO BE ABLE TO AFFORD TO BUY ANYWAYS. WE'RE WAYYY BEYOND BROKE AS A JOKE.


even rent-a-center won't rip us off any more.

the '92 topaz has become the official car of the U.S. treasury team.


...but anyways, ya def fuck Joe Lieberman. Why let one fucker have so much power cause he runs on the douche-bag ticket?? Although it's hate the game not the player here too, though.
Author:  Godzilla1960 [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 1:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
The U.S. spent more than $2.2 trillion on health care in 2007, more than three times the $714 billion spent in 1990, and over eight times the $253 billion spent in 1980.

That works out to $7,421 per resident, among the highest of all industrialized countries.

Our health care system is designed solely to produce profits for the health care and insurance industries. Our bodies are living ATM machines for these vultures. If we had a single payer, government run system, you might be able to afford your rent-a-center tv, daz.
Author:  daz28 [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 1:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
Godzilla1960 wrote:

Our health care system is designed solely to produce profits for the health care and insurance industries. Our bodies are living ATM machines for these vultures. If we had a single payer, government run system, you might be able to afford your rent-a-center tv, daz.[/color]

I agree. I don't see where there is room for profit in such an important area as this. It's like saying the bookie was an important part of gambling before the internet came along, and should still be given his 10% cut. Just fucking cut the shareholder out of the equation, period. Believe me Zilla, I have no idea why some people can't get this simple principle.
Author:  Hammygoodness [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 3:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
The simple principle is that a system based off of profits will be more effective, efficient and groundbreaking than one run by a bureaucracy.

Ham
Author:  Godzilla1960 [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 10:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
Hammygoodness wrote:
The simple principle is that a system based off of profits will be more effective, efficient and groundbreaking than one run by a bureaucracy.

Ham

Yet, the facts don't bear you out, Hammy. The truth is that European style, single payer systems, run by the government, are more efficient and provide better health care than our for profit system.

The World Health Organization ranked the health systems of 191 nations. France and Italy had the top health care systems; the United States was an embarrassing 37th.

What is the goal of European and Canadian health care systems? To provide health care for their people.

What is the goal of our health care system? To make money for insurance companies, hospitals, and HMOs.

We seriously have our priorities screwed up, and the fact that so many Americans wish defend this ass-backwards system only confirms it.
Author:  End The Curse [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 11:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
Godzilla1960 wrote:
We seriously have our priorities screwed up...[/color]

You got a mouse in your pocket?
Author:  Crosscheck [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
Godzilla1960 wrote:
Didn't I tell you, Cross, that you had no need to fear Democratic control of both houses of Congress and the White House? What a bunch of spineless bunglers.


You know what? You're a sincere and passionate guy. I almost feel bad for ya on this one ;)

Godzilla1960 wrote:
Yet, the facts don't bear you out, Hammy. The truth is that European style, single payer systems, run by the government, are more efficient and provide better health care than our for profit system.

Yeah, the government run system we have now is quite efficient...at denying claims.

Image
http://biggovernment.com/2009/10/05/ama ... re-claims/

Yet the latest crack at a public option the Democrats can come up with is pushing everyone into the medicare. Brilliant!
Author:  TRBirdman [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
Wake up folks! The real issue is NOT healthcare, or cap and tax, or all the other BS.

Government control over our lives is what is at stake. The main thrust of the 2,000 pages is the structure of our government and society, a power grab by the government to have ridiculous control over our lives and to redistribute wealth.

To pass this in ANY form will be disastrous. All this debate about public option and amendments is just a distraction. The Progressives will be able to reinstate later what doesn't make it in now, because they will have the power to do so, to shove it down our throats. Therefore, they are content now to make any bribes necessary to get it passed.

Those in Congress voting for this, selling out their honor, are committing political suicide. They're toast.
Author:  Crosscheck [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 9:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
Now Howard Dean says kill the Senate bill because of no public option....

http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/healt ... nate-bill/
Author:  CriminallyVu1gar [ Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
TRBirdman wrote:
Wake up folks! The real issue is NOT healthcare, or cap and tax, or all the other BS.

Government control over our lives is what is at stake. The main thrust of the 2,000 pages is the structure of our government and society, a power grab by the government to have ridiculous control over our lives and to redistribute wealth.

To pass this in ANY form will be disastrous. All this debate about public option and amendments is just a distraction. The Progressives will be able to reinstate later what doesn't make it in now, because they will have the power to do so, to shove it down our throats. Therefore, they are content now to make any bribes necessary to get it passed.

Those in Congress voting for this, selling out their honor, are committing political suicide. They're toast.


www.tinfoilonmyhead.com
Author:  YankeeInRaleigh [ Wed Dec 16, 2009 1:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
TRBirdman wrote:
Wake up folks! The real issue is NOT healthcare, or cap and tax, or all the other BS.

Government control over our lives is what is at stake. The main thrust of the 2,000 pages is the structure of our government and society, a power grab by the government to have ridiculous control over our lives and to redistribute wealth.

To pass this in ANY form will be disastrous. All this debate about public option and amendments is just a distraction. The Progressives will be able to reinstate later what doesn't make it in now, because they will have the power to do so, to shove it down our throats. Therefore, they are content now to make any bribes necessary to get it passed.

Those in Congress voting for this, selling out their honor, are committing political suicide. They're toast.



I honestly cannot tell if you're being sarcastic or insane.
Author:  Crosscheck [ Wed Dec 16, 2009 1:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
YankeeInRaleigh wrote:
I honestly cannot tell if you're being sarcastic or insane.

One should always be skeptical and resistant to government taking power and liberty from its citizens.

Why aren't you?
Author:  Godzilla1960 [ Wed Dec 16, 2009 4:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
Crosscheck wrote:
YankeeInRaleigh wrote:
I honestly cannot tell if you're being sarcastic or insane.

One should always be skeptical and resistant to government taking power and liberty from its citizens.

Why aren't you?

That is not a bad default position, however in the 21st century government is not the only large entity that threatens our freedom and livelihoods. Today, mega-corporations have more money, power, and influence than any government that Thomas Jefferson and his fellow Enlightenment philosophers could have ever imagined.

Don't you think it is time, Cross, that Libertarians took into account the threat to our liberty posed by these international cartels, which have no national alligiance, nor accountability to the people?
Author:  Crosscheck [ Wed Dec 16, 2009 4:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
You say that as if they're separate things.

Pick your poison...Some corporations control Republicans and some control Democrats. The very large ones control both.

Corporations however don't have a direct influence on my liberty or freedoms...government does.
Author:  Hammygoodness [ Wed Dec 16, 2009 4:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
Plus, a corporation cannot mandate that you support them. The government can mandate you do all sorts of things many of us would rather not.

Ham
Author:  daz28 [ Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
Oligopoly may as well be monopoly. It's 3 corporations promising not to compete with each other too much, so as to take the advantage away from the consumer.

When the government MANDATES health insurance, they will, in effect, be mandating that you support the oligopoly(corporation).

You may want to re-think it a bit.

Crosscheck wrote:

Corporations however don't have a direct influence on my liberty or freedoms...government does.

C'mon X. I know you're a lot smarter than this. It's called lobbying, and it's how laws are legislated now. It's not directly A to B, but it may as well be.
Author:  Godzilla1960 [ Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: All forms of the Public Option Effectively Dead
Well, thanks to the Republicans and the Republicans lite (Lieberman and the other Democratic hacks who are in the pocket of the insurance industry) we are going to get a mild attempt to regulate insurance that they are calling health care reform, but which is really a huge windfall for insurance companies who stand to gain millions of new customers.

You folks talk as if being able to undergo a major medical procedure without having your family go bankrupt is some sort of government intrusion into your lives. So, you think the people of Canada and Europe aren't free?
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