Squanto wrote:
They were protecting us just fine with metal detectors and normal pat downs that didn't involve grabbing crotches.
http://www.sabresjunkie.com/forum/ |
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| TSA again oversteps their authority http://www.sabresjunkie.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=4873 |
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| Author: | Squanto [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:17 am ] |
| Post subject: | TSA again oversteps their authority |
Short version: Guy in the security line refuses the new full-body-look-at-your-dirty-bits backscatter machine, opts for the pat down. In the pat down area, he tells the TSA guy "If you touch my junk, I'll have you arrested." A bit douchey, but I can't say I blame him. Sup comes over. Guy says he'll submit to a normal (not groin touching) pat down, and the standard metal detector, but he won't submit to being groped. TSA sup decides not to let the guy board his flight. Guy says ok, and is escorted out of the security area without incident. He goes to the ticket counter to get a refund for his ticket, which he gets. On his way out of the terminal, he gets stopped and told that he can't leave the airport unless he goes back and completes a security screening. The same security screening that he was escorted out of by TSA agents!! Some back and forth ensues, the TSA threatens him with a $10,000 fine and a CIVIL (??) suit, and he tells them to go ahead and do it. Best part? He has audio of almost the entire thing from his cell phone. http://johnnyedge.blogspot.com/2010/11/ ... tween.html This security theater is just astounding. The TSA is nothing more than a bunch of mall cops that like the wave their cocks in the air. It's sickening. |
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| Author: | NYIntensity [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
To be honest, I REALLY don't understand the gripes with the backscatter machines. It's not like there's a section on pornhub or youporn for backscatter snapshots; it's people being completely insecure. In the interest of security, the machine should be the ONLY option; if you don't want to be screened, then don't fly. I agree with your bit on the TSA "attendants" though; I think mall cop syndrome is the best comparison you could make. Almost on par with campus cops. |
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| Author: | mechaphil [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
Gotta find it but apparently there was also an incident where a 3 year old got violated by a TSA attendant. If already posted about, all righty then. |
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| Author: | Squanto [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
I have a couple issues with the backscatter machines. 1. It's a virtual strip search on a presumably innocent person. 2. The machines are not supposed to be able to save images, but it's been confirmed from multiple sources that they do save images for 'training and evaluation' purposes. 3. The resulting pat downs for not wanting to use the machines are very invasive, much more than the pat downs and wandings you used to get if selected for secondary screening. 4. The machines can't penetrate skin. The old balloon in the rectum trick used by drug smugglers would not be caught by these devices. It's all security theater. What was there before (x-rays of carry on baggage and shoes, metal detector, basic pat-down and wanding) was reasonable and fairly effective. Adding these machines doesn't do much more, and subjecting people who don't want to use them to a MORE vigorous and invasive pat down doesn't make sense. |
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| Author: | Crosscheck [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
http://www.optoutday.com/ They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. |
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| Author: | Squanto [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
You and I don't always agree, but I'm 100% with you on this one. It's gotten to the point that I'm more willing to drive 8 hours to Boston when I go instead of spending $100 and 45 minutes to fly from Buffalo to Logan. It bothers me to be treated like a criminal when traveling inside my own country. |
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| Author: | sabresindc [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
It annoys me that people have to go out of their way to be a pain in the ass. Yeah, being patted down is not the greatest thing in the world but you have to open your mouth and be a douch?? If they grab your junk then file a friggin complaint. Unfortunately they may be like 20 year old mall cops but they are there to try and protect us. If they didn't give this numbnut a hard time and let him on the plane and the shit blew up. Who would be hung out to dry, the TSA guy who let the guy on the plane. As usual, the media is blowing this waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay out of proportion. |
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| Author: | Squanto [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
I'd like to point out that the media isn't blowing anything out of proportion. This is the blog post of the affected person, not a media report. Secondly, the guy wasn't being a hardass. He was asserting his rights. He has every right to ask that a stranger doesn't grab his junk as a condition of flying. EDIT: Playing the 'If they let him go and something blew up' card is pure fearmongering. Let's face it; if a terrorist shows up at the airport with his explosives, the system has already failed. |
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| Author: | NYIntensity [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
Crosscheck wrote: http://www.optoutday.com/ They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. I fought for your liberty and safety. Just a little reminder. Don't try to say what I do or don't deserve. |
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| Author: | NYIntensity [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
Squanto wrote: Secondly, the guy wasn't being a hardass. He was asserting his rights. He has every right to ask that a stranger doesn't grab his junk as a condition of flying. Agreed. He also has every right not to fly. As far as the virtual strip search, I agree that it's invasive. In all honesty though, what harm does it actually do? Save me the liberties schtick, the police can pull you over for a busted tail light and pat you down if you act suspicious. The backscatter scan is quick and efficient. |
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| Author: | sabresindc [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
Squanto wrote: I'd like to point out that the media isn't blowing anything out of proportion. This is the blog post of the affected person, not a media report. Secondly, the guy wasn't being a hardass. He was asserting his rights. He has every right to ask that a stranger doesn't grab his junk as a condition of flying. EDIT: Playing the 'If they let him go and something blew up' card is pure fearmongering. Let's face it; if a terrorist shows up at the airport with his explosives, the system has already failed. I actually saw this story on my news yesterday with the video the guy took from his phone, so yes the media is involved. Second, well that depends on FAA rules. You can assert you rights and I'm sure they are trained not to touch anyone in any sensitive areas. He went there with a purpose to get a rise out of the TSA so he would get more hits on his blog, plain and simple. I hope the TSA or FAA fine the shit out of him. I agree, if a terroist does make it that far then the system failed. Basically they are the failsafe. If all else fails then they have to get it right. That is why it's so important for them to be that way. NYIntensity, I agree. He has a right not to fly if he doesn't like the security procedures |
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| Author: | sabresindc [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
Crosscheck wrote: http://www.optoutday.com/ They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Ok, well then fuck it. Lets take down all the xray machines and security at our airports and let anyone board planes. That'll solve this issue. The government has a responsiblity to protect their citizens and that is what they're doing. They are trying to do their best with technology so they DON'T have to pat people down. |
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| Author: | Squanto [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
NYIntensity wrote: Squanto wrote: Secondly, the guy wasn't being a hardass. He was asserting his rights. He has every right to ask that a stranger doesn't grab his junk as a condition of flying. Agreed. He also has every right not to fly. As far as the virtual strip search, I agree that it's invasive. In all honesty though, what harm does it actually do? Save me the liberties schtick, the police can pull you over for a busted tail light and pat you down if you act suspicious. The backscatter scan is quick and efficient. Well, the difference in the tail light thing is that by having a busted tail light, you're breaking the law, and they have the right to pull you over and investigate further. When you go to the airport, you haven't broken any laws. You're just there to get on your flight and go somewhere. A strip search under those conditions is a bit much. My biggest beef with it is that they went to this enhanced pat down if you don't want the x-ray. For the last 9 years, the pat down with the wand and the metal detectors was fine. Why all of a sudden do they have to take such an aggressive stance and move to this crotch groping method? What happened to change things? |
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| Author: | Squanto [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
sabresindc wrote: Ok, well then fuck it. Lets take down all the xray machines and security at our airports and let anyone board planes. That'll solve this issue. The government has a responsiblity to protect their citizens and that is what they're doing. They are trying to do their best with technology so they DON'T have to pat people down. They were protecting us just fine with metal detectors and normal pat downs that didn't involve grabbing crotches. FFS, the pilot's union, who might have a vested interest in not wanting planes to be blown up, thinks it's too much. |
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| Author: | Crosscheck [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
NYIntensity wrote: Crosscheck wrote: http://www.optoutday.com/ They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. I fought for your liberty and safety. Just a little reminder. Don't try to say what I do or don't deserve. 1. that wasn't directed at you 2. Those are the words of Benjamin Franklin |
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| Author: | NYIntensity [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
Squanto wrote: They were protecting us just fine with metal detectors and normal pat downs that didn't involve grabbing crotches.
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| Author: | Squanto [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
Before 9/11, I never walked through a metal detector at an airport, nor was I ever patted down. |
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| Author: | Crosscheck [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
 Surely we, as a society, can agree when we've reached our limit of this crap. We're already putting up with the screenings, taking shoes off, 3 oz shampoo bottles and we put up with that for almost a decade without so much as a wimper...enough is enough. The backscatter machines and intensive pat downs are making no one safer. |
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| Author: | sabresindc [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
Squanto wrote: Before 9/11, I never walked through a metal detector at an airport, nor was I ever patted down. Metal detectors were already in place for years before 9/11. Maybe not in podunk little puddle jumper airports but the BNIA there were xray machines that everyone (including non-passengers) had to go through to get to the gate. |
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| Author: | PuckSniperPensel [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: TSA again oversteps their authority |
NYIntensity wrote: Squanto wrote: They were protecting us just fine with metal detectors and normal pat downs that didn't involve grabbing crotches. |
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