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mechaphil
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 12:34 pm 
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Vanek_Fanatic_26 wrote:
fly as hale wrote:
GoSabres29 wrote:
So do you think Enroth will have a few starts, even without goaltending injurys?

Yeah I definitely think we'll see Enroth up here more frequently than last season. It's why Lalime only signed a one-year deal, Darcy is planning on bringing Enroth up as soon as possible, but he just doesn't think he's ready to become a full-time backup yet.


Lalime signed a one-year deal because he's old and nearing the end of his NHL career.

Also, for those of you who are saying that Roloson is on the market, you're all wrong. Cap Geek says that he's still got a year left on his current contract, and I doubt the Islanders trade him now that Biron is gone and DiPietro always has that possibility of being injured.

Yep.

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Sabresfansince1980
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 3:52 pm 
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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
Sabresfansince1980 wrote:
It's an, "oh I guess this game doesn't mean as much so I can slack off" type of response from a team needing leadership or an attitude adjustment.


I'm kind of surprised you made this statement.

I don't believe they play worse in front of Lalime because they slack off. I believe they are overly conscious that their back-up goaltender is in and in attempting to play conservative play timid and passive. You don't want to give up goals, so you play back, and in doing so lose your aggressiveness and forecheck.

Too much of the attitude "let's allow only 1-2 goals for Patty Lala" and not enough of the attitude "let's score 3-4 goals for Patty Lala."


Well you may be right, but either way the team hasn't performed in front of Lalime. To be more fair, it probably has to do with how poorly the team plays during back-to-backs.


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fly as hale
PostPosted: Fri Jul 09, 2010 12:49 pm 
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Vanek_Fanatic_26 wrote:

Lalime signed a one-year deal because he's old and nearing the end of his NHL career.

And because Darcy was only looking to sign a goalie to a one-year deal, because of Enroth's development. Which is one of the reasons why Biron wasn't signed, he wanted something longer than just a one-year deal.

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NYIntensity
PostPosted: Fri Jul 09, 2010 2:25 pm 
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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
Sabresfansince1980 wrote:
It's an, "oh I guess this game doesn't mean as much so I can slack off" type of response from a team needing leadership or an attitude adjustment.


I'm kind of surprised you made this statement.

I don't believe they play worse in front of Lalime because they slack off. I believe they are overly conscious that their back-up goaltender is in and in attempting to play conservative play timid and passive. You don't want to give up goals, so you play back, and in doing so lose your aggressiveness and forecheck.

Too much of the attitude "let's allow only 1-2 goals for Patty Lala" and not enough of the attitude "let's score 3-4 goals for Patty Lala."


This is basically what Lindy said; "Lalime's numbers were good; we didn't support him."

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daz28
PostPosted: Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:47 pm 
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I think we've just conditioned ourselves to saying, "meh, it's an ok move".

I DON'T FUCKING WANT LALIME!


...and for those who like elaboration, it's because he sucks. Throw all the stats in the world at me, but I know if Miller goes down, this guy has NO chance. Begin commotion about his 'playing time'. Whatever the reason is, he WILL suck behind a "happy" Miller(used to be making a man bloody rich made him happy).

CriminallyVu1gar wrote:

Too much of the attitude "let's allow only 1-2 goals for Lindy Ruff" and not enough of the attitude "let's score 3-4 goals for Ryan Miller."


FIXD


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sabresrocker56
PostPosted: Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:54 pm 
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I have seen this guy stand on his head (sometimes literally) against the Penguins and the Blackhawks (just an example of some games he has played in). He doesn't "suck". Consider he only gets 12 games a year and has to play each and everyone of them cold. His job isn't to be Ryan Miller, his job is to come in to give Miller some rest and do everything HE can to win a hockey game. He is not Ryan Miller, nobody is. If the team in front of him doesn't show up there is only so much he can do. He's not a superstar goalie. We need to understand that. When you have the best goalie in the world in net for most games, you develop a pretty stingy taste for goalies. I will say he's not great in shootouts. I've seen that in person too. He's gotta work on not biting on dekes right away. Let's not forget when he came in relief for Miller against the Penguins and we were able to erase that deficit partly because Lalime was able to keep the rest of the pucks out of the net.

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NYIntensity wrote:
Sabres2Sabres wrote:
If Miller and Myers were playing like they did last year, we'd probably be over 500 right now.

If I had decided to jerk off instead, I probably wouldn't be paying child support...


"Grier coming in over the line. He leaves it to Gaustad. The shot. THEY SCOOOREE!! RING UP ANOTHER ONE FOR THE GOOSE!!! HONK IF YA HEAR THE GOOSE!! 3-0 BUFFALO!"


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daz28
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 12:04 am 
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sabresrocker56 wrote:
his job is to come in to give Miller some rest and do everything HE can to win a hockey game.

His job is to win hockey games. We've already gave the guy every excuse in the book. No one is blasting Pat for performance, we're blasting management for his W/L. This argument is moot, and always has been.


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sabresrocker56
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 12:12 am 
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daz28 wrote:
sabresrocker56 wrote:
his job is to come in to give Miller some rest and do everything HE can to win a hockey game.

This argument is moot, and always has been.

How so?

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NYIntensity wrote:
Sabres2Sabres wrote:
If Miller and Myers were playing like they did last year, we'd probably be over 500 right now.

If I had decided to jerk off instead, I probably wouldn't be paying child support...


"Grier coming in over the line. He leaves it to Gaustad. The shot. THEY SCOOOREE!! RING UP ANOTHER ONE FOR THE GOOSE!!! HONK IF YA HEAR THE GOOSE!! 3-0 BUFFALO!"


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daz28
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 12:15 am 
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sabresrocker56 wrote:
daz28 wrote:
sabresrocker56 wrote:
his job is to come in to give Miller some rest and do everything HE can to win a hockey game.

This argument is moot, and always has been.

How so?

He doesn't win hockey games for whatever the reason(you can provide upto 10 if you want). I already said this, and it's common knowledge.

edit: this is what I said, seems you clipped context:

His job is to win hockey games. We've already gave the guy every excuse in the book. No one is blasting Pat for performance, we're blasting management for his W/L. This argument is moot, and always has been.


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sabresrocker56
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 12:25 am 
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daz28 wrote:
sabresrocker56 wrote:
daz28 wrote:
sabresrocker56 wrote:
his job is to come in to give Miller some rest and do everything HE can to win a hockey game.

This argument is moot, and always has been.

How so?

He doesn't win hockey games for whatever the reason(you can provide upto 10 if you want). I already said this, and it's common knowledge.

edit: this is what I said, seems you clipped context:

His job is to win hockey games. We've already gave the guy every excuse in the book. No one is blasting Pat for performance, we're blasting management for his W/L. This argument is moot, and always has been.

You clipped a lot from my post too. I gave examples of good performances he had (40 saves against the Hawks, relief shutout of the Pens, yielding 1 goal to those same Pens in a SO loss because our offense couldn't get it done). He's played well in a lot of games where he didn't have offensive and/or defensive support. I can think of two real stinkers he had (one game against ATL and that one against MIN) where the loss was on his shoulders because of bad goaltending. But he's a backup. Miller let's in some bad goals from time to time too. And, quite frankly, Lalime was our only available option at backup at this point. Unless you wanted Yann Danis.

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NYIntensity wrote:
Sabres2Sabres wrote:
If Miller and Myers were playing like they did last year, we'd probably be over 500 right now.

If I had decided to jerk off instead, I probably wouldn't be paying child support...


"Grier coming in over the line. He leaves it to Gaustad. The shot. THEY SCOOOREE!! RING UP ANOTHER ONE FOR THE GOOSE!!! HONK IF YA HEAR THE GOOSE!! 3-0 BUFFALO!"


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daz28
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 12:30 am 
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I did clip you, but my point is he doesn't win enough, which makes 2 or 3 good performances moot. I mean if you or I was not getting the job done at work, we wouldn't expect to be kept on, would we?

Anyhow, if you think Lalime is adequate, then so be it. This isn't worth arguing about.


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mechaphil
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 12:38 am 
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Individual job performances are an entirely different animal than pro sports. Do I think Lalime is very good anymore? No. Do I think that he had been hung out to dry by his teammates too often? 100% yes. Wins are an inadequate measure of a goalie's play, as you very well ought to be aware. And if you aren't, you're no kind of hockey fan.

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daz28
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 12:53 am 
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mechaphil wrote:
Individual job performances are an entirely different animal than pro sports. Do I think Lalime is very good anymore? No. Do I think that he had been hung out to dry by his teammates too often? 100% yes. Wins are an inadequate measure of a goalie's play, as you very well ought to be aware. And if you aren't, you're no kind of hockey fan.

If so, I wouldn't re-sign with said teammates who "hung me out to dry 100%". Don't need to know anything about athletics to understand that. Anyways, as I said, this argument is pointless(much like Lalime).


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NYIntensity
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 7:25 am 
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If I'm not mistaken, the core of this squad has never shown up in front of anyone BUT Miller (Biron years back, yes, but Miller wasn't the ace-in-the-hole he is now).

This team doesn't play well in front of a goalie they don't trust. The trust issue is probably Lindy's fault (not playing his backups enough for the players to get comfortable with them in net), but when you have a goaltender like Ryan Miller in your back pocket, you're eventually damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you-don't.

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X-pensfan
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 8:58 am 
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PuckSniperPensel wrote:
I guess Miller doesn't value rest.

This move pisses me off. When's Enroth going to get his chance to prove his worth? He's not even valuable trade bait until he gets some NHL starts.

Lalime better come back in the best shape of his life, because if he doesn't I won't feel sorry for him when he gets booed for a soft goal.



Goal tending depth is never a bad thing. And be careful of what you wish for.

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sabresindc
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 9:20 am 
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NYIntensity wrote:
If I'm not mistaken, the core of this squad has never shown up in front of anyone BUT Miller (Biron years back, yes, but Miller wasn't the ace-in-the-hole he is now).

This team doesn't play well in front of a goalie they don't trust. The trust issue is probably Lindy's fault (not playing his backups enough for the players to get comfortable with them in net), but when you have a goaltender like Ryan Miller in your back pocket, you're eventually damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you-don't.

Exactly!!!! We have all complained that Lindy never plays Lalime enough and it comes down to Lindy not trusting him to do well. It'll be another 70+ game season for Miller

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NYIntensity
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 10:35 am 
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I meant essentially, not eventually, fwiw.

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CriminallyVu1gar
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 3:29 pm 
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Playing too passive, not dictating play enough, especially with Lalime in net and they're conscious that they don;t have Miller to bail them out when they brain fart and let up 4 on 1 rushes. They need to be more aggressive, take play to their opponents.

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CriminallyVu1gar
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 3:30 pm 
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daz28 wrote:
I think we've just conditioned ourselves to saying, "meh, it's an ok move".

I DON'T FUCKING WANT LALIME!


...and for those who like elaboration, it's because he sucks. Throw all the stats in the world at me, but I know if Miller goes down, this guy has NO chance. Begin commotion about his 'playing time'. Whatever the reason is, he WILL suck behind a "happy" Miller(used to be making a man bloody rich made him happy).

CriminallyVu1gar wrote:

Too much of the attitude "let's allow only 1-2 goals for Lindy Ruff" and not enough of the attitude "let's score 3-4 goals for Ryan Miller."


FIXD


None of that makes any sense.

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CriminallyVu1gar
PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 3:30 pm 
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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
Lalime is a Decent backup goalie. Compare him to goalies that played 10-25 games last season:

Image

Decent.

Image

Decent.


They get too caught up in this:
Image

And forget that it's because of this:
Image


And now this season we're looking at this:
Image


Some people evidently ignored this post.

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