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| Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... http://www.sabresjunkie.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1418 |
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| Author: | jvaccaro6 [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 10:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
Ok Vanek, last night, you played like crap until the 3rd period. What the hell dude, you need to play YOUR game. The one time he drove the net hard, he scores a goal on a brilliant Thomas Vanek wrap-around. The issue I take with his game, especially over the past few is that, he's not playing his game. He's not driving the net hard, he's not using his awesome shot, he's just not using his skill set to his ability. He needs to use the skills he's been given, not try to play like a play maker, or a power forward. He's a sniper, and he's a strong puck handler...he needs to play like it. I'm not looking for a flame Vanek thread here, but does anyone else feel like he's trying to be a player he's not? I mean, when Vanek has played his game, and taken shots this year, he's been effective, shooting right around 12.5% last time I looked. He's gotta get about 8-10 shots a game, and he'd be unstoppable. He's got to stop trying to be a set up man, and get himself into scoring positions and put the puck on net. |
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| Author: | PuckSniperPensel [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 10:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
I still haven't figured out Vanek's deal yet. Personally, I think he's always been very strong in only a few areas, and defensemen now know how to play him, so he's had to try to change his game a bit. I need to see more, but I can't really chastise him for not moving his feet. He seems to skate as hard as he can. When he gets a full head of steam, he's fast. But his acceleration is pretty bad. He needs to find more ways to be sneaky and get behind the play like he used to. Use his smarts instead of his physical ability. |
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| Author: | Wyohomeboy [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 11:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
He quits skating way too soon when entering the offensive or defensive zone in my opinion, even Rayzor was on him last night. One generally gets flamed every time one says something bad about him, so I generally don't voice my displeasure with him, but it's tough to score when your in coast mode from the blue line. He did make Gus look really bad last night, but at that point we were up 4-1. |
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| Author: | VanekKing [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 11:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
Hi Im Vanek, Im getting paid $7 mill annually.. I don't need to work hard.. |
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| Author: | slesh [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
But he scored a goal. What could people want from him? He scored his 1 goal in 4 games. Its not like he isn't getting consistent. I don't understand why people say trade him, or bench him, or give him less ice time. He scored a goal. He is our teams greatest scoring threat. Why do people need to critique his play or his effectiveness? I really don't understand why people are coming down on him, he scored a goal. 
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| Author: | Stuuuuuuu [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
Vanek has been one of the team's best two-way forwards the last month and a half or so in my opinion. I know, I know, he's lazy right???? Well look, I've seen him make plenty of good defensive plays in the last month, and I've seen him make enough offensive plays to have a lot more points with better luck. And with Gaustad out, Vanek has been THE guy taking punishment in front of the net, and he's played a big part in plenty of goals he didn't score or get the assist on. You want to talk about who is stinking up the ice? Let's look at #19 and #21. |
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| Author: | PuckSniperPensel [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
slesh wrote: But he scored a goal. What could people want from him? He scored his 1 goal in 4 games. Its not like he isn't getting consistent. I don't understand why people say trade him, or bench him, or give him less ice time. He scored a goal. He is our teams greatest scoring threat. Why do people need to critique his play or his effectiveness? I really don't understand why people are coming down on him, he scored a goal. His shots per game and points per game averages are down substantially from last year. I'm not saying Thomas has been horrible, and I believe he's putting in the effort. He just hasn't found his game yet this season. Last year, his shots per game average was 2.89 and his points per game average was .87. So far this season, he's at a 2.45 shots per game average and a .67 points per game average. He's getting better, but he's not quite there yet. In my opinion, Thomas's game is very strong in some important areas, but he's relatively weak in others that are necessary for players to be considered star scorers. If the return was great, trading Vanek would not be the end of the world for this team. I like the guy, and I think he's a good player, but he desperately needs to work on foot speed and acceleration. He also needs to pick up some better 1 on 1 moves, as he's limited to one that defensemen have learned and neutralize every time. |
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| Author: | ironyisadeadscene [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
or pominville. hes been as useless as tits on a bull. |
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| Author: | jvaccaro6 [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 3:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
I think the point of my post has been missed...I didn't say anything about him being lazy, or not back checking, he's been great compared to Connolly and Hellen Stafford, my point was, he's trying too much to be a player he's not offensively. He's not using his shot, or his size. He's trying to be the old Tim Connolly rather than Thomas Vanek I feel like. |
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| Author: | Stuuuuuuu [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 3:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
jvaccaro6 wrote: I think the point of my post has been missed...I didn't say anything about him being lazy, or not back checking, he's been great compared to Connolly and Hellen Stafford, my point was, he's trying too much to be a player he's not offensively. He's not using his shot, or his size. He's trying to be the old Tim Connolly rather than Thomas Vanek I feel like. OK, I got you. Might have been responding more to the perception I was getting from the responses to your OP than to your actual idea. I don't mind the way TV is playing lately. I think overall, he's been helping the team more than hurting it. I'd like him to score more, but honestly, whatever gets the W will work for me. It almost seems like he can't win in public perception. When he scored a bunch, he'd get criticized for being one-dimensional. Now that he's not scoring a lot, but doing some of the other things people used to jump on him for not doing. That's just a general observation, I'm not talking about you specifically here Jay because I don't think that's what you're saying. |
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| Author: | YankeeInRaleigh [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 3:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
Stuuuuuuu wrote: It almost seems like he can't win in public perception. When he scored a bunch, he'd get criticized for being one-dimensional. Now that he's not scoring a lot, but doing some of the other things people used to jump on him for not doing. Ya know...thats true, I remember that general sentiment when he was more one dimensional (and scoring more)...I never quite got it. If he's putting pucks in the net I could care less if he's a vigilant backchecker, whether he coasts, whether he WHATEVER, scoring excuses almost all. I think ruff should rethink his desire to make vanek into a complete two way player, and just find whatever niche it is thomas needs to light the lamp. |
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| Author: | PuckSniperPensel [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 3:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
YankeeInRaleigh wrote: Stuuuuuuu wrote: It almost seems like he can't win in public perception. When he scored a bunch, he'd get criticized for being one-dimensional. Now that he's not scoring a lot, but doing some of the other things people used to jump on him for not doing. Ya know...thats true, I remember that general sentiment when he was more one dimensional (and scoring more)...I never quite got it. If he's putting pucks in the net I could care less if he's a vigilant backchecker, whether he coasts, whether he WHATEVER, scoring excuses almost all. I think ruff should rethink his desire to make vanek into a complete two way player, and just find whatever niche it is thomas needs to light the lamp. That'd be tough to do if he wants to keep our system effective. This teams' biggest asset has been the pressure they put on the puck carrier from the front and back sides. I don't understand why people have their panties in a bunch about these goal scoring issues anyways. We're winning games. A lot of them. And that's all because of the way these players are dedicating themselves to playing good defense and back checking hard. The goals will come with minor tweaks and better decisions. Right now, just let them be. |
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| Author: | CriminallyVu1gar [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 5:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
Lindy said during last nights postgame that Vanek has been playing hurt. |
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| Author: | sixx58 [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 6:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
I know a lot of you guys will say that I'm biased because of my heritage but except for yesterday's game I think Thomas was playing great for the last couple of weeks. Even Lindy Ruff gave him credit for his effort. But people in Buffalo will never get over the contract issue when it comes to TV. Personally I don't think he will EVER be able to live up to his rediculous contract and he will NEVER be the superstar everybody wants him to be. But then I think he contributes a lot more to the team than a lot of people give him credit for. And unless he makes the game winning goal in game 7 of the Stanley Cup Finals people in Buffalo will never be satisfied with him. That's just my perception being thousands of miles away. On the other hand if you make the big bucks you might as well be able to deal with this kind of criticism. Just my 2 cents... |
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| Author: | NYIntensity [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
He gets paid $85,365.85 a GAME. His average TOI is 16:36, and plays 21 shifts. That's approximately $5,000 a minute, or about $4,000 per shift. He doesn't deserve any less criticism than he gets. He hardly ever hits, and I wouldn't even mind that, if he'd go into corners and come out with the puck. He does neither. |
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| Author: | daz28 [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
PuckSniperPensel wrote: YankeeInRaleigh wrote: I think ruff should rethink his desire to make vanek into a complete two way player, and just find whatever niche it is thomas needs to light the lamp. That'd be tough to do if he wants to keep our system effective. The goals will come with minor tweaks and better decisions. Right now, just let them be. The system needs to incorporate Thomas just as much as Thomas needs to be incorporated into the system. Flexibility is what it needs. The idea that you can have 12 two-way forwards and win is silly. PLAYERS HAVE ROLES. Vanek is a GOAL-SCORER. If your NOT going to incorporate him into the team, then trade him ffs(or waive him, whatever; just like they did with Max). |
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| Author: | sixx58 [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
NYIntensity wrote: He gets paid $85,365.85 a GAME. His average TOI is 16:36, and plays 21 shifts. That's approximately $5,000 a minute, or about $4,000 per shift. He doesn't deserve any less criticism than he gets. He hardly ever hits, and I wouldn't even mind that, if he'd go into corners and come out with the puck. He does neither. I'm a 100% fine with your opinion but at the end of the day this also is - like I said - a "contract issue". As soon as somebody argues with some kind of dollar amounts per shift or whatever it always boils down to "he's not worth that kind of money" which he clearly isn't. But nobody forced Darcy to give him that - and I repeat- "rediculius" contract. |
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| Author: | NYIntensity [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
daz28 wrote: PuckSniperPensel wrote: YankeeInRaleigh wrote: I think ruff should rethink his desire to make vanek into a complete two way player, and just find whatever niche it is thomas needs to light the lamp. That'd be tough to do if he wants to keep our system effective. The goals will come with minor tweaks and better decisions. Right now, just let them be. The system needs to incorporate Thomas just as much as Thomas needs to be incorporated into the system. Flexibility is what it needs. The idea that you can have 12 two-way forwards and win is silly. PLAYERS HAVE ROLES. Vanek is a GOAL-SCORER. If your NOT going to incorporate him into the team, then trade him ffs(or waive him, whatever; just like they did with Max). I'm going to be blunt....Lindy tried to make a system that worked for the players. Then they brought in the Grier, and now the players change their game to work for the system. It is my wish daily that we will NEVER change the system for a player, ever again. |
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| Author: | icehound [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
Hate on me - That's fine: Vanek for Hemsky, right now, one-for-one. And yes, I know Hemsky's gone for the rest of the season. It just ain't working - Three years, now...it ain't working. Send him to where he's wanted and get's a new start, and free up the cap with long-term IR, so we can all move on. Suck it up and get a player or two that'll get you to the Cup. My two. |
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| Author: | NYIntensity [ Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Alright Vanek, now I'm doing it... |
sixx58 wrote: NYIntensity wrote: He gets paid $85,365.85 a GAME. His average TOI is 16:36, and plays 21 shifts. That's approximately $5,000 a minute, or about $4,000 per shift. He doesn't deserve any less criticism than he gets. He hardly ever hits, and I wouldn't even mind that, if he'd go into corners and come out with the puck. He does neither. I'm a 100% fine with your opinion but at the end of the day this also is - like I said - a "contract issue". I'm not complaining about the contract, not at all. He *can* be worth that money. My problem is that I know if *I* were being paid that, I'd think to myself every time I was put on the ice for a shift "I better put on a $4000 effort". |
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