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Sabresfansince1980
 Post subject: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:27 pm 
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That was the overall goal total. Boston scored one more goal in six games, while Hecht missed all six and Vanek missed almost four.

There's a lot of trade this guy, that guy, all the guys kind of talk right now. It's a little understandable for fans to be negative right now. But with the injuries and the horrible calls that led directly to two Boston goals (really f-ing important goals that come as close to deciding a game as there is), I can't jump in with that crowd. I'm one of the least rah-rah fans here, but with a healthy line-up and something near fair officiating, there only needs to be a few upgrades for this team to be a Cup contender.

One forward - maybe not possible this summer, but Ennis might be that guy.
Two d-men - Weber looks to be a sure solid addition and there's cap space to sign a UFA
One goalie - Enroth or any number of available UFAs will be better than Lalime.

I only see improvement for next season. It would be great to have a team that is good enough to overcome every bad call and unlucky injury, but with a salary cap there just aren't going to be teams that can be that good. Every team has looked beatable in the 1st round, and Buffalo could easily (EASILY) have beaten Boston if Vanek didn't get hacked down, or any of three horrible calls didn't go against Buffalo.

But no matter how much the team improves, the unfortunate fact of this bush league is that players can get chopped out of the playoffs and referees can greatly influence the outcome. So there is no guarantee for any team, regardless of talent, how their moves will translate into playoff success.


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BlueandYellow
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:32 pm 
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The reason we say trade is because if we lost to Boston we sure as hell wont win the cup or go really far in the playoffs.

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hockeyplaya00
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:38 pm 
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But you have to think though that they were also missing Savard and Stuart


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PuckSniperPensel
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:41 pm 
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Lately, I agree with everything you say SFS1980.

Spot on analysis.

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Skyline_BNR34
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:49 pm 
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I would say Vanek was a huge killer to us, he was the only PPG player in the playoffs for us.

He had 2 goals and 1 assists in the 2.00001 games he played for us this postseason.

I'm sure Hecht would have been a huge part to us killing off more powerplays too than we did.

Oh well, it's over now, time to move on for next year. Getting to the playoffs is the first step to winning a cup, first get there, and keep getting there and maybe eventually you can win a cup.

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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
No need for violence, just tell her she's got a game misconduct and show her the door.

Rud wrote:
As I said in the GDT, the call on Rivet was horseshit. The Bruins player was holding onto Rivet's stick like it was the last fucking raft on the Titanic.


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Sabresfansince1980
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:56 pm 
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B&Y, like I said in the first post, every team has looked beatable.

And yes, with Savard and Stuart Boston could have been better, but Buffalo had to deal with their best offensive player, playing at his best, going down during the series. Hecht was declared out just before it started, and that is two holes on the top two lines that any team would struggle to adjust to on such short notice.

5-on-5 scoring was Buffalo-15, Boston-10. The special teams took a complete nose dive. The PP is explained partly by the loss of Vanek, and the PK had something to do with Hecht. Mostly I believe it has to do with coaching.


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PuckSniperPensel
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:57 pm 
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Hecht's lock down defensive play and 20+ goals being out certainly didn't help us one bit.

I almost wonder if we missed him more than Vanek.

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Skyline_BNR34
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 3:58 pm 
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PuckSniperPensel wrote:
Hecht's lock down defensive play and 20+ goals being out certainly didn't help us one bit.

I almost wonder if we missed him more than Vanek.

He was missed on the PK far more then we would probably think.

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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
No need for violence, just tell her she's got a game misconduct and show her the door.

Rud wrote:
As I said in the GDT, the call on Rivet was horseshit. The Bruins player was holding onto Rivet's stick like it was the last fucking raft on the Titanic.


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powerplayer
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 5:07 pm 
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The Bruins were without Savard, Stuart and Seidenberg. Three solid players, one of them an all-star. At least Vanek played in 2 of the 6 games. Yes, I know Vanek scores more (at least last year), but the Boston players did a lot of other things well that Boston had to go without.

Boston had a ton of injuries this season and probably would have finished higher in the rankings if they were as healthy as, say, the Sabres. BUT WHO CARES? That's the way the chips fell. Boston had more injuries and finished 6th. Sabres had less injuries and finished 3rd. And let's call the goaltending a draw.

I cannot honestly say the Sabres are better than the Bruins. If you look at the regular season series (4-2, Bruins) and the post season series (4-2, Bruins) and take into consideration all the injuries (Boston had more) and who did and did not play at all in the playoffs, you really cannot definitively say the Sabres are the better team. It just doesn't stand to reason.


Last edited by powerplayer on Tue Apr 27, 2010 5:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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CriminallyVu1gar
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 5:16 pm 
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I agree for the most part. One thing I'd like to see.

Figure out why 5/6 of our top two lines looked like dog shit. Connolly, Roy, Pominville, Torres, and Stafford. Figure out what guys are least likely to look like dogshit again. (Personally I think Connolly and Pominville). Trade/release/let go the rest.

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YankeeInRaleigh
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 5:18 pm 
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I agree we probably missed Hecht...but cmon, if we had any actual chance at going anywhere in the playoffs the lack of Jochen freaking Hecht is NOT the deciding factor.


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Sabresfansince1980
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 5:50 pm 
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Powerplayer, this isn't to so much say that Buffalo is better than Boston or should've beaten them. It's to say that this team doesn't need to be blown up to become a Cup contender. They could've easily beaten Boston without a few things going against them. The rest of the playoffs are wide open and anybody can win, so I wouldn't get too down on the team just because they lost in the 1st round. They're a better team than that.


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Skyline_BNR34
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 10:24 pm 
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Hecht was a huge part of our PK in the season, he is one of the best defensive forwards in the game and a great presence on the forecheck also.

Boston had to adjust without Savard, but they had adjusted and signed a few guys to replace him. They were long without him, we lost Vanek once again after getting him back and he was hot, and was going to be a huge force in the playoffs. Vanek alone would have made the team play better. I'm sure we would have won game two if he had not been hacked out, we were pressing again and then Boychuk is a bitch and hacks him in the knee because he realized Vanek would kill them.

I don't know, but if we didn't lose Vanek in game two and had he played in all the games, Buffalo wins, and our PP actually scores a few with him.

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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
No need for violence, just tell her she's got a game misconduct and show her the door.

Rud wrote:
As I said in the GDT, the call on Rivet was horseshit. The Bruins player was holding onto Rivet's stick like it was the last fucking raft on the Titanic.


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gr8daygo
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 10:29 pm 
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what were the penalties called in the series... love to see that comparison....lol

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Sabresfansince1980
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 10:31 pm 
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I don't know the exact penalty count, but Boston was 6/22 on the the PP, while Buffalo was 0/19.


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powerplayer
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:15 pm 
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Skyline_BNR34 wrote:
Hecht was a huge part of our PK in the season, he is one of the best defensive forwards in the game and a great presence on the forecheck also.

Boston had to adjust without Savard, but they had adjusted and signed a few guys to replace him. They were long without him, we lost Vanek once again after getting him back and he was hot, and was going to be a huge force in the playoffs. Vanek alone would have made the team play better. I'm sure we would have won game two if he had not been hacked out, we were pressing again and then Boychuk is a bitch and hacks him in the knee because he realized Vanek would kill them.

I don't know, but if we didn't lose Vanek in game two and had he played in all the games, Buffalo wins, and our PP actually scores a few with him.


If Savrad was in, not to mention Stuart and Seidenberg, there would have been one of the top playmakers in the league (assist-master Savard) going against the Sabres and an even more effective D (Seidenberg & Stuart). You gotta see both sides of the coin here.

Boston has suffered this season, yet still prevailed. No way around that.


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Van_Da_Man
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:20 pm 
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The play that summarized up the series was when we doinked a shot off the post on the PP in the first or second overtime of game 4. Close, but no cigar.

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Skyline_BNR34
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:32 pm 
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powerplayer wrote:
Skyline_BNR34 wrote:
Hecht was a huge part of our PK in the season, he is one of the best defensive forwards in the game and a great presence on the forecheck also.

Boston had to adjust without Savard, but they had adjusted and signed a few guys to replace him. They were long without him, we lost Vanek once again after getting him back and he was hot, and was going to be a huge force in the playoffs. Vanek alone would have made the team play better. I'm sure we would have won game two if he had not been hacked out, we were pressing again and then Boychuk is a bitch and hacks him in the knee because he realized Vanek would kill them.

I don't know, but if we didn't lose Vanek in game two and had he played in all the games, Buffalo wins, and our PP actually scores a few with him.


If Savrad was in, not to mention Stuart and Seidenberg, there would have been one of the top playmakers in the league (assist-master Savard) going against the Sabres and an even more effective D (Seidenberg & Stuart). You gotta see both sides of the coin here.

Boston has suffered this season, yet still prevailed. No way around that.

But they were injured in the regular season, Vanek was in and was hacked out in the playoffs.

Those three players weren't going to be back and everyone knew it, it's not like Boston was successful with those players. Also take out Satan, because he was signed after Savard was injured, so his two GWG's don't happen.

If you want those players in, you might want to take out Boychuk, because he didn't get the ice time until the defensemen in front of him went down also.

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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
No need for violence, just tell her she's got a game misconduct and show her the door.

Rud wrote:
As I said in the GDT, the call on Rivet was horseshit. The Bruins player was holding onto Rivet's stick like it was the last fucking raft on the Titanic.


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GoSabres29
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 12:11 am 
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Sabresfansince1980 wrote:
That was the overall goal total. Boston scored one more goal in six games, while Hecht missed all six and Vanek missed almost four.

There's a lot of trade this guy, that guy, all the guys kind of talk right now. It's a little understandable for fans to be negative right now. But with the injuries and the horrible calls that led directly to two Boston goals (really f-ing important goals that come as close to deciding a game as there is), I can't jump in with that crowd. I'm one of the least rah-rah fans here, but with a healthy line-up and something near fair officiating, there only needs to be a few upgrades for this team to be a Cup contender.

One forward - maybe not possible this summer, but Ennis might be that guy.
Two d-men - Weber looks to be a sure solid addition and there's cap space to sign a UFA
One goalie - Enroth or any number of available UFAs will be better than Lalime.

I only see improvement for next season. It would be great to have a team that is good enough to overcome every bad call and unlucky injury, but with a salary cap there just aren't going to be teams that can be that good. Every team has looked beatable in the 1st round, and Buffalo could easily (EASILY) have beaten Boston if Vanek didn't get hacked down, or any of three horrible calls didn't go against Buffalo.

But no matter how much the team improves, the unfortunate fact of this bush league is that players can get chopped out of the playoffs and referees can greatly influence the outcome. So there is no guarantee for any team, regardless of talent, how their moves will translate into playoff success.

dont tell this to Darcy. otherwise the line-up is going to be the exact same next year...

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X-pensfan
 Post subject: Re: 16-15
PostPosted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 12:31 am 
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BlueandYellow wrote:
The reason we say trade is because if we lost to Boston we sure as hell wont win the cup or go really far in the playoffs.



The cold hard truth is that they were not built for a long grueling playoff run. The Sabres were a great regular season team, lots of speed. But in the playoffs you have to be big and strong to survive, few teams if any have ever won a Stanley Cup playing nothing but pond hockey. It was not for a lack of effort, they played hard but you can only throw yourself into a wall so many times before you get tired of picking yourself back up again.

There's a TON of positive things surrounding this team, and in this cap era weaknesses can be corrected quickly. You don't need the 84' Oilers to win a Cup, but the solution starts at the top. Pressure from ownership to seriously win It. Wise management, and on down the line. I haven't payed a great deal of attention to how the Sabres run their shop up until now, but I watched a great GM by the name of Craig Patrick build a mini-dynasty in Pittsburgh (and maintain it). So I think I know what it takes. Ray Shero is a good young GM, I don't agree with everything he does but he's good. He hasn't undone any of the rebuilding, but I think any GM could win with what the Pens acquired over the lean years.

What I would do, find a way to trade for Malkin! :)

Vanek+Stafford+1st round draft pick for Malkin,

Then you got your triple M core of Malkin, Miller, and Myers. Build around that.

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