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patkane88
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:01 am 
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sabresEH wrote:
ironyisadeadscene wrote:
uh, phanuef was a norris candidate just two years ago. id gladly take neon dion over kaberle. any day. players, ya know, occasionally have down years.

And for the last two years he's played poorly. I watch a lot of Flames Canucks and Oilers games. I know the players on each team. I think this was a good trade for both teams. But an underachieving only offensive dman at 6.5 per(who reportedly is a douche and a cancer) over an overachieving veteran dman at 4.25. Yeah your right Phaneuf all the way. Kaberle has 38 assists to Phaneuf's 12. And kaberle is on th leafs. I didnt know they've scored 38 goals as a team.
However, was Phaneuf a beast 2 years ago? Yeah. Has he been since? Far from it. Does he have the talent to be a great defenceman? Fuck yes. But too say Phaneuf over Kaberle right now especially at their price tags is ridiculous. Get over the Phaneuf of 2 years ago and watch the Phaneuf of now.


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ironyisadeadscene
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:03 am 
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the phaneuf of now is only 25. not that old, considering most defensemen dont fully develop until they are 26-28 years old. if he was that good before, its completely possible he can do it again.

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patkane88
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:07 am 
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ironyisadeadscene wrote:
the phaneuf of now is only 25. not that old, considering most defensemen dont fully develop until they are 26-28 years old. if he was that good before, its completely possible he can do it again.


Ohh for sure but the Leafs are in a world of hurt for at at least a few more years.

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Skyline_BNR34
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:10 am 
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How many times does it need to be said, we are second in goals allowed this year at this very moment with the only team with less goals scored on them is the Devils.

We don't need defenders we need offenders guys to put the puck in the net. Why add another defensemen, that means Weber needs to sit longer, Sekera isn't as terrible as he used to be and played well when he played with Patches that last game.

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No need for violence, just tell her she's got a game misconduct and show her the door.

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patkane88
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:14 am 
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Skyline_BNR34 wrote:
How many times does it need to be said, we are second in goals allowed this year at this very moment with the only team with less goals scored on them is the Devils.

We don't need defenders we need offenders guys to put the puck in the net. Why add another defensemen, that means Weber needs to sit longer, Sekera isn't as terrible as he used to be and played well when he played with Patches that last game.


Wouldn't you think that Sekera would fetch an offensive player this team so desperately needs?

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sabresEH
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:20 am 
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ironyisadeadscene wrote:
the phaneuf of now is only 25. not that old, considering most defensemen dont fully develop until they are 26-28 years old. if he was that good before, its completely possible he can do it again.

I know that. But if the reports are true that he is a douche and likes the keith tkachuk diet than it will be hard for him to regain that form. If he was just having some fun and this trade wakes him, Burke looks great cause Phaneuf can be a real dominant player. Just hasn't been that way lately. But definitely the potential for him to be better than Kaberle is there. But right now Kaberle is one of the best d-men for his dollar.

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patkane88
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:24 am 
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Kabrle has to be on his way out now, if Phaneuf gets his act together Kabrle could and might be expendable.

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sabresEH
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:34 am 
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patkane88 wrote:
Kabrle has to be on his way out now, if Phaneuf gets his act together Kabrle could and might be expendable.

I'm thinkin' Kaberle is where Burkie is gonna get his forwards back, but he has the NTC and Burke said he wouldn't ask him to waive it, so he'll wait till the summer. I dont think there's a doubt in anyone's mind's that Poni is out the door by the deadline, so he could bring back a decent prospect or pick. It's also been said that Burke is willing to take salary dumps for draft picks.

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Skyline_BNR34
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:35 am 
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patkane88 wrote:
Skyline_BNR34 wrote:
How many times does it need to be said, we are second in goals allowed this year at this very moment with the only team with less goals scored on them is the Devils.

We don't need defenders we need offenders guys to put the puck in the net. Why add another defensemen, that means Weber needs to sit longer, Sekera isn't as terrible as he used to be and played well when he played with Patches that last game.


Wouldn't you think that Sekera would fetch an offensive player this team so desperately needs?

He could easily help us fetch that player and I would trade him for it as Myers is the PP QB we needed badly after Campbell left.

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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
No need for violence, just tell her she's got a game misconduct and show her the door.

Rud wrote:
As I said in the GDT, the call on Rivet was horseshit. The Bruins player was holding onto Rivet's stick like it was the last fucking raft on the Titanic.


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Sk8haggard9
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:54 am 
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Skyline_BNR34 wrote:
patkane88 wrote:
Skyline_BNR34 wrote:
How many times does it need to be said, we are second in goals allowed this year at this very moment with the only team with less goals scored on them is the Devils.

We don't need defenders we need offenders guys to put the puck in the net. Why add another defensemen, that means Weber needs to sit longer, Sekera isn't as terrible as he used to be and played well when he played with Patches that last game.


Wouldn't you think that Sekera would fetch an offensive player this team so desperately needs?

He could easily help us fetch that player and I would trade him for it as Myers is the PP QB we needed badly after Campbell left.


Myers on the PP is just unreal. That long reach really helps keeping the puch in, he has great vision for passes, awesome shot selection, and even though he is so huge somehow he can sneak right into the slot. Having him and Vanek on our team should ensure a pretty decent PP for the next few years.


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Sabresfansince1980
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 4:34 am 
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http://www.tsn.ca/columnists/bob_mckenzie/?id=308500

A very nice assesment of the Tor/Cal trade, but not what the Phaneuf idolizers will want to hear.


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adambuffalo
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 9:39 am 
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I think it will be some time before anybody will truly know who the winners and loser were. From all the reports i've seen Dion hasn't played well in 2 years, he's a bad locker room guy and has a poor workout ethic. Now, the first part is obvious and the next two are heresay, but being in Calgary's management, they would have a good idea what kind of character he has.
Next, we have to remember that the Flames still have J-Bo, Regehr, Sarich, Giordano and now Ian White. Their 6 d-men average age is 26 y/o with Sarich being the oldest at 30. They should be ok there.
Finally, clearing Dion's $6.5m cap hit and having Joki's $5.5m ending with the season gives the Flames a bit to work with. They are now in a position to make a move for Kovy for next season.

As for the Anaheim trade, this one seems pretty clear. The Ducks were going to trade JSG and his $6m to anyone that would take him. The Leafs were good with this only because the Ducks agreed to take Blake off their hands. Hopefully Blake will be able to play better in Anaheim. Some guys (especially and overpaid American) just don't do well in the high demand market of Toronto.

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End The Curse
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 10:36 am 
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I think the trade smacks of desperation for the Leaves. They got a top defenseman and a goalie whose best years are behind him, but gave up all of their offense and a pretty damn good d-man in Ian White.

The cornerstone of a top d-man is critical to build around, but that's a lot of eggs to put into one basket and this team is still a lot of eggs away.

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Jim Bob
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 10:45 am 
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patkane88 wrote:
Kabrle has to be on his way out now, if Phaneuf gets his act together Kabrle could and might be expendable.


I think that Kaberle and Phaneuf will look good together.

Kaberle can QB the PP and set Phaneuf up for his one timer bombs from the point.

If I'm Brian Burke, I'm moving one of Komisarek, Beauchemin, or Finger before I even think about moving Kaberle.

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Los9090
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 12:34 pm 
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Sabresfansince1980 wrote:
http://www.tsn.ca/columnists/bob_mckenzie/?id=308500

A very nice assesment of the Tor/Cal trade, but not what the Phaneuf idolizers will want to hear.

Phaneuf has regressed a bit, but he's still nasty. I look forward to watching him play the Sabres, should add some fuel to the rivalry

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SabresBillsFan
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 4:00 pm 
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sabresEH wrote:
patkane88 wrote:
Kabrle has to be on his way out now, if Phaneuf gets his act together Kabrle could and might be expendable.

I'm thinkin' Kaberle is where Burkie is gonna get his forwards back, but he has the NTC and Burke said he wouldn't ask him to waive it, so he'll wait till the summer. I dont think there's a doubt in anyone's mind's that Poni is out the door by the deadline, so he could bring back a decent prospect or pick. It's also been said that Burke is willing to take salary dumps for draft picks.



I'm hoping no one trades for Kaberle! I'm sick of teams making trades with Burke as he seems to get the better of most deals. When are most GM's gonna learn!


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patkane88
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 12:06 pm 
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Jim Bob wrote:
patkane88 wrote:
Kabrle has to be on his way out now, if Phaneuf gets his act together Kabrle could and might be expendable.


I think that Kaberle and Phaneuf will look good together.

Kaberle can QB the PP and set Phaneuf up for his one timer bombs from the point.

If I'm Brian Burke, I'm moving one of Komisarek, Beauchemin, or Finger before I even think about moving Kaberle.


Kaberle can get way more in return for any one of those other guys right now.

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AudSabres
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 3:45 pm 
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I think with Dion on the roster now, it may change Burke's train of thought in regards to Kaberle. He now knows he's got a big hitter with a cannon on the blue line and may start to lean on Thomas a little bit to wave it. Myself, if I were Kaberle, I would have waved it a long time ago to get away from this train wreck that is the Make Beliefs. I agree though, to move him will bring in some decent quality forwards. Maybe not superstars, but players which can assist with Kessell.

As for Dion, man… have you guys heard him speak? Dear jesus he needs to develop a personality! He's like a programmed robot or someone who has had a lobotomy!

Get that man a speech therapist or Hooked on Phonics or something and quick! I hope if Aliens are looking at our species for prime candidates to consider for higher things that they don’t monitor the way he talks. Dear god…

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psychemedisabrefan
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 7:38 pm 
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i'd love to see toronto not be able to trade kaberle and have kaberle go to free agency only because the leafs would just lose him. plus i wouldn't want to trade with burke to get him. kaberle would be that offensive QB we want and if we could off guys that are worthless cap space, and screw burke and toronto that would be nice. However seeing how burke clearly got the upper hand with the Moore trade i'm more to the leafs just getting fucked.

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psychemedisabrefan
 Post subject: Re: Phaneuf to Leafs
PostPosted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 7:38 pm 
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As well here is mendola's view on the whole trades

MENDOLA: Leafs awake, but Sabres weren't sleeping

Nick Mendola

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(WGR 550) -- If you're on any sort of message board or radio talk box today, chances are you're reading/hearing a lot about how Brian Burke acquired two key pieces to the Maple Leafs' rebuilding puzzle, and he did. Dion Phaneuf and J.S. Giguere are massive stabilizing blocks in the wobbly Jenga-like tower that is Toronto.

But if you're one of those thinking that the Sabres and other teams were sleeping, you're simply incorrect.

It pains me to say this, because Phaneuf is one of my favorite players in the entire league and Buffalo needs to make a move or two before the deadline. They need a veteran presence and another scorer or power play point man (Read my thoughts on that here). But the ransom Flames general manager Darryl Sutter got from the Leafs is top-notch. He gets a goal scorer locked up through and at the apex of his career as well as three other players who will fill nice roles for him.

In Niklas Hagman, the Leafs have offloaded their top goal scorer. By dealing Ian White, they've sent away one of their only consistent five-on-five players (White's one of only three plus players on the Leafs). Matt Stajan is Toronto's second-leading scorer. Hagman's signed through 2012 at a remarkably reasonable $3 million, while White will be a restricted free agent and Stajan will be a UFA after this season.

The Leafs get Phaneuf, struggling through a brutal season in which he'll need a minor miracle to match his career average in points. He'll find his way back, but Phaneuf has really shown a drop-off since signing a massive $6.5 million deal as a 23-year-old.

To make as close a Buffalo comparison as possible, general manager Darcy Regier would've had to send Jason Pominville (locked up), Drew Stafford (RFA), Henrik Tallinder (UFA) and Nathan Paetsch or Adam Mair to Calgary to pick up Phaneuf. That's not a move that helps a division-leader become a powerhouse. It's a step backwards to build for the future. A third-place team doesn't do that to their locker room, fans or bottom line (especially when you consider that before Phaneuf's deal is done, Tyler Myers will likely be making Phaneuf money or better).

As for Toronto's acquisition of J.S. Giguere, it's an ingenious move, but why would Darcy Regier do it? He has his goaltender locked up for years. "Giggy" is reunited with his old goalie coach, and the Leafs have off-loaded Jason Blake's contract -- which was a foolish one to start with for a player his size and his age. Yes, it's retrospect, but it's no surprise his numbers have slipped. I argued last week for the Flyers to scoop up Giguere and a No. 2 for Briere and Boucher. This is essentially the same deal, only the Flyers are a contender.

To put it simply, the Leafs are digging out of a hole bigger than the one the Sabres were in when they failed to re-sign Chris Drury and Daniel Briere, and some of that unearthing was done by Burke (Mike Komisarek is not -- as I said at the time -- a 4.5 million dollar blueliner). Phaneuf and Giguere are terrific acquisitions, but as Pat Malacaro wrote in greater detail, they are long-term solutions with short-term struggles to even return to their top form.

The only shame in the whole matter is that the Sabres didn't have a tradeable piece that could land them Stajan, White and Hagman. The package that Calgary received for Phaneuf ends any debate as to whether the Sabres could've picked up the bruising offensive defenseman.

Email: [email protected]

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