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| Ichiro is a machine http://www.sabresjunkie.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=4363 |
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| Author: | Wozniak [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 3:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Ichiro is a machine |
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/Ichi ... ers-092310 Quote: Ichiro Suzuki became the first major league player with 10 straight 200-hit seasons on Thursday, breaking his own record with a single to center in the fifth inning of the Mariners' game against the Blue Jays. 
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| Author: | CriminallyVu1gar [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 3:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
best mariner ever? |
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| Author: | Stuuuuuuu [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 4:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
CriminallyVu1gar wrote: best mariner ever? Without a doubt. Maybe one of the best baseball players ever, period. I saw the list of players who have had 9 or more 200-hit seasons yesterday, and Ichiro was in a group with Pete Rose, Ty Cobb, Joe DiMaggio, and Honus Wagner among others. An EXTREMELY select group. Throw in his defense, speed on the basepaths, and his cannon of a throwing arm, and he becomes of game-changing force. I've seen him take over games time and time again. Not many right fielders that can do that. ICHIRO! ICHIRO! |
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| Author: | CriminallyVu1gar [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 4:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Stuuuuuuu wrote: CriminallyVu1gar wrote: best mariner ever? Without a doubt. Maybe one of the best baseball players ever, period. I saw the list of players who have had 9 or more 200-hit seasons yesterday, and Ichiro was in a group with Pete Rose, Ty Cobb, Joe DiMaggio, and Honus Wagner among others. An EXTREMELY select group. Throw in his defense, speed on the basepaths, and his cannon of a throwing arm, and he becomes of game-changing force. I've seen him take over games time and time again. Not many right fielders that can do that. ICHIRO! ICHIRO! Cobb was better on the basepaths than Ichiro. Cobb also went to three World Series. |
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| Author: | Stuuuuuuu [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 4:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
I wasn't around to see him run, but it's hard for me to believe that if you put Cobb and Ichiro side by side in their primes that Cobb could outrun Ichiro. I'm not trying to argue that he is a better player than Cobb though, just saying he belongs in that kind of company. |
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| Author: | CriminallyVu1gar [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Ichiro may be faster, but Cobb took more chances on the basepaths, sometimes absurd chances, not to mention the fact that Cobb has a mountain more stolen bases. |
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| Author: | Stuuuuuuu [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Can't believe I'm gonna school CV on stats. Cobb played 24 seasons and had 897 SB, that's an average of 37.4 per season. Ichiro has played 10 seasons and has 382 SB, pretty easy math there 38.2 per season. Booooyah! |
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| Author: | CriminallyVu1gar [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
That's right, I forgot Ichiro spent a bunch of years in Japan. |
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| Author: | CriminallyVu1gar [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Of course, Cobb also played in a shorter season. So Cobb's 897 SBs in 3,034 games give him .296 per game to Ichiro's .242 (382 in 1577). 
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| Author: | Stuuuuuuu [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Didn't start playing in Seattle until he was 27, whereas Cobb started in the majors at 18. |
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| Author: | CriminallyVu1gar [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Stuuuuuuu wrote: Didn't start playing in Seattle until he was 27, whereas Cobb started in the majors at 18. Cobb still accumulates SBs at a greater rate (see above). The thing I wonder is how much the advancement of the skills of players as a whole impact the numbers. I honestly don't know if SBs were higher in the majors then or now. I would guess then since catchers are so much better at throwing people out, but the stolen base leader is a relatively recent player. (Though those numbers can at least partially be attributed to longevity). |
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| Author: | Stuuuuuuu [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
As far as speed, I wouldn't be surprised if Ichiro was already getting slower when he arrived in North America. Power numbers I could see getting better with age, but not speed. I would also assume that both pitchers and catchers throw faster now than they did in Cobb's day, thus making stolen bases harder to come by. |
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| Author: | Stuuuuuuu [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Ichiro has averaged 1.41 hits per game as opposed to Cobb's 1.38. |
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| Author: | CriminallyVu1gar [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Stuuuuuuu wrote: As far as speed, I wouldn't be surprised if Ichiro was already getting slower when he arrived in North America. Power numbers I could see getting better with age, but not speed. I would also assume that both pitchers and catchers throw faster now than they did in Cobb's day, thus making stolen bases harder to come by. Yeah, I dunno how the ball even plays into it. The ball nowadays is very different than it was in Cobb's time. Reading this, Ichiro might be the most Cobb like, or most complete player in the league since Cobb, although he'll never lead the league in home runs. It's a shame Ichiro isn't more interesting, or doesn't play for a more interesting team. |
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| Author: | Stuuuuuuu [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
I don't even really care about baseball anymore, but I still love to watch Ichiro play. I'm glad I've been able to see him play in person, and live in the Mariners' broadcast area for his entire career. |
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| Author: | Van_Da_Man [ Thu Sep 23, 2010 6:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Now for a tough question... Hall of famer? |
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| Author: | Stuuuuuuu [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Van_Da_Man wrote: Now for a tough question... Hall of famer? Absolutely zero doubt in my mind he belongs in the Hall of Fame. Holds the record for most hits in a season, and for the most consecutive seasons with 200 hits. In fact, he has not yet had a season with less than 200 hits. He could even reach 3,000 hits (in fact more than likely will) despite the fact he started playing in the majors at 27. This is a no-brainer for me. |
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| Author: | Squanto [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Van_Da_Man wrote: Now for a tough question... Hall of famer? First ballot HoFer without a hint of debate. |
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| Author: | ironyisadeadscene [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 4:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
CriminallyVu1gar wrote: best mariner ever? uh, absolutely not. even though hes not.. well.. you know, longevity also hurts him some. even though ichiro is OUTSTANDING, a sure legend, id put him second, just ahead of a ball player who gets very little recognition, edgar martinez. ive never seen a player like ichiro, doubt i ever will again. when all is said and done, we may be looking at a top 10 player of all time. the dude is incredible. |
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| Author: | CriminallyVu1gar [ Fri Sep 24, 2010 4:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Ichiro is a machine |
Squanto wrote: Van_Da_Man wrote: Now for a tough question... Hall of famer? First ballot HoFer without a hint of debate. I never make assumptions with MLB HOF voters, lol. |
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