My only reason for pointing it out was that I pointed out some things I though SF1980 was generalizing on, and I thought it only fair to point out the same in your comments.

Definitely don't need to debate your cannabis advocacy again here, we've beaten that topic to death in the past.

Squanto (and Crosscheck), my first post was sarcastic, so "karma" wasn't really meant to be a very accurate term.

After things got more serious I went into detail about some bigger concepts, but I didn't judge or generalize anything about this kid. I commented on how he acted in his last few moments, which was very well described by his own friends and witnesses that gave statements at the scene. There's nothing in his last moments to generalize about.

You (and others) are actually making generalizations about me, which is ironic. Disagree all you want with how I feel about people that act fatally reckless, but I'm hardly taking an off-the-wall bizarro stance that nobody in their right mind would as well. Otherwise I've made fairly simple statements that value how we act toward people while they (and we) are alive over when they (and we) are dead. Somehow that makes me a prude, douche, f-ing Nazi and a bad parent, and I didn't respond once with similar name calling.

I value the time we have while we're alive so much that I loathe the people and circumstances that kill others and take that time away due to malicious or reckless bahavior. I'll try to change people for the better while they're alive, but if they still don't value life and respect others, and die as a result of that behavior, I just don't have any time or energy for them anymore.

I'll get even more specific. I had a friend that was a great person, great dad, great professional, and a great example in my career. He had a seatbelt that didn't work in his personal vehicle. I bugged him to get it fixed but he never did. He would have survived his car wreck with serious injuries, but instead he was dead on scene with no seat belt on. Of course everybody rained praise on him afterward. Tragic? Yes. Accident? Yes. Sad? All of that and more, but he could have PREVENTED it. To this day I'm angry that he didn't care enough, or take the seatbelt seriously enough to protect himself, at least for his family's sake. His one mistake negated all the other great things about him, because that one mistake quite literally negated him.

Why don't people take the small things seriously? Why do people goof off on the balcony? Why do they have to get right to the edge of the cliff with no safety gear? Why do they have to race in the street? Now as a cop I obviously don't live in a bubble, and I don't wear surgeon gloves and a mask everywhere I go, but I know how to have fun (lots of great times actually) without endangering myself or others. I'm pretty sure good people would want someone like me (a prudish, douchey, Nazi) around more often than most other people.

All I have to say is if you enjoy life so much etc etc etc...then stop posting about how this kid had it coming and go get a root beer float or something. Sheesh.

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What a pointless response, DP. Why even bother unless you're just trying to be adversarial again? I don't have that many posts, so you might want to direct that logic toward the more avid posters around here. Besides, I enjoyed life yesterday. Today I have parental duties.

This is quite possibly one of the most arrogant things I've read around here in a long time.

The main issue is the use of the term karma in the thread title, which suggests that the kid somehow got his just deserts. I know you have since explained that it was a poor choice of words and that's fine.

So what if he was being belligerent while drunk, it's not like any of us have never been belligerent.

Since you can die from falling down stairs while drunk, or simply from falling and hitting your head wrong as easily as you can from falling off a balcony, I see this as a tragedy and nothing more or nothing less.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

Jebus...I sure dont agree with a lot of what SFS1980 has to say, on...a lot of subjects, but he seems to be getting attacked rather mercilessly, for not a very good reason.

For the most part, I agree with what he's saying here. This kid did not respect himself enough, nor have enough sense in his thick-fucking-head to NOT fall off a balcony. Why exactly do we need that sort of dipshittery in this world? Who exactly is there to feel bad for besides his parents?

Humans are far from perfect, and unfortunately, our actions sometimes sting us in the worst of ways.

This 17 year old kid lost his life while having fun with friends on vacation.

I'm amazed by the lack of empathy shown by some people here. Sure, maybe it was a little boneheaded, but we all do boneheaded things sometimes, without expecting it to kill us.

For all you know, he stepped on his shoelace and flipped over the railing.

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Wheelhouse

What if he died by falling awkwardly and hitting his head?

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

Then we'd be having a different discussion.

First of all, it would be sympathy, I've never belligerantly yelled at someone and flipped my fool ass off a balcony, so I cannot empathize with this guy. And what exact measure of sympathy is due? Surely less than the thousands that die from preventable illnesses, hunger, draught, natural disasters do...why would this up and coming college football player who made a bad DECISION, get such an outpouring of sympathy from you guys?

But its not like he did something egregiously stupid like driving drunk or wandering down to the river (A Clarkson University Killer). In this case, the bad decision is simply losing his balance over a balcony. Something that usually, drunk or otherwise, doesn't result in death. I think if you're engaging in an activity where statstics are in favor of you not dying, you're not really making that poor of a decision.

Now that having been said, leaning over said balcony while impaired wasn't that good of a decision either.

Like I said, I just see it as a tragedy, nothing else. No karma, no serves him right, no poor decision making, just a tragedy.

It's not like anyone else here has never overestimated their abilities/tolerance/balance/whatever.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

Can we close this thread already. The "Wow someone died, that sucks," VERSUS "I hate drunk assholes so I'm taking this moment to rant on this kid," argument is winding in circles.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

You feel sorry for him because that's the way you should feel if someone dies without deserving it (killing someone, assaulting someone, ETC). He was drunk, but it's his fault. I feel sorry for him, but it's his fault.

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"Counting all the assholes in the room, I'm definitely not alone!" ~ Michael Poulsen, Volbeat, Still Standing.

You're right. Haha screw him. What a dumbass he is, getting himself killed. I'll never do anything stupid enough to put myself in a situation where I could get hurt, even unintentionally.

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Wheelhouse

Maybe if I wrote a 6 paragraph essay on how great I am and how people want to hang out with me then it would have been more to your liking.



I was trying to bring some levity to the thread but screw it.

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Christ, what a pathetic response dude. You're basically saying "I dont want to actually reply to what you said, so i'll take your stance to an absurd degree and pretend I agree with it to try and make you look foolish and heartless", when we both know you're capable of actually dissecting an argument and replying with some degree of intelligence. If i'd have known you'd resort to just wasting my time with childish bullshit, Adam, I'd not have bothered responding to you.

All very true, i'm definitely not espousing the 'karma' angle myself, although I dont really believe in 'instant karma' anyways...so, it just doesnt really seem to apply.

And this was more than foolish, no? You're drunk, you're on the fifth floor...let me repeat, YOU'RE ON THE FIFTH FUCKING FLOOR...do you lean way over the balcony for any reason other than to catch a falling baby or something? I dont. I sure as hell dont do it to be some drunken idiot yelling at people in the next room. I just dont have any sympathy for this guy who did this ALL to HIMSELF. I'm not going "screw this kid, i'm glad he's dead, etc etc etc", i'm just not jumping on the sympathy train for such a ridiculous example of boneheadedness.

Then you're ignoring the previous sentence and straining to be offended. Most good people (law abiding, calm, unobnoxious, etc) in a restaurant, bar, park, movie theater, would rather have someone sitting next to them that is the same, not a rude, loud, drunken jerk. I also said "someone like me", as in law abiding, calm, unobnoxious, etc, not specifically me as if I think my looks, personality, or "turds gleam with the sweat nectar of awesomeness". There are plenty of people like me around, but I can't confindently say that they are a majority. Therefore "most other people" (IMO) do not have or display all of those attributes.

What percentage of people do you think haven't been arrested, suspended from school, fired from a job, in several physical confrontations (drunk or not), have a clean credit record, or regularly cheat on their spouses or carelessly sleep around? How many people do you really think can answer "no" too all those things these days? Add or subtract anything you want from the list to fit your moral compass, but you get the idea. I doubt most people fall into that category, hence the phrase, "most other people". Just because I fit doesn't mean that I think I'm such a great guy either. I think those values should be a baseline, or a statistical norm. I really believe it's more of a commentary on the lack of values and how "bad" society is or can be than anything else.

I'll just wait for the next over-reactionary comment that exaggerates my words into whatever works for the next put down.

I became frustrated by your lack of sympathy, and took a short cut.

Look, my point is, outside of suicide related deaths, natural human instinct is to avoid death at all costs. We all want to live to see tomorrow; to enjoy life to the fullest. Every species on earth is programmed to think that way.

Because of this, nearly all deaths, no matter how idiotic, deserve some degree of sympathy, because someone's time on this earth is being taken away from them against their will.

As a human being who enjoys existence on this planet, I feel sympathy for someone who lost his life on a vacation with a bunch of friends.

Forget arguing about whether or not it was an idiotic way to go, because that part doesn't matter. When someone unwillingly leaves this earth, there is always a degree of sadness involved.

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Wheelhouse