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Which camp of fans are you in?
Impatient fans that want Darcy to behave like Bob Gainey or Glen Sather 16%  16%  [ 5 ]
Patient fans cognizant of the fact that the Sabres just won their fifth division title and 3rd 100-point season in team history 84%  84%  [ 27 ]
Total votes : 32
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NYIntensity
PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:39 pm 
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well those of you who dont already know my girlfriend is amazing and super hot!

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mechaphil
PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:06 pm 
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ironyisadeadscene wrote:
kind of off topic, but any chance we could get a count down clock to sabres training camp at the top of the boards? i think it would be fun.

You've been over on Buffalo Range a lot since registering, haven't you? ;)

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ironyisadeadscene
PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:07 pm 
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yeah, and its friggin cool as shit they have that countdown clock!

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mechaphil
PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:08 pm 
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I totally agree! In fact, I was scoping it out to add a countdown to the Sabres season to my blog :D

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ironyisadeadscene
PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:10 pm 
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too bad i hope the bills go 0-16...

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Van_Da_Man
PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 11:56 am 
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Why? What would 0-16 accomplish that 7-9 wouldn't? You know they won't draft the right players anyway.

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"I'm going to go to the spa and have a hot tub and massage and relax," Miller said. "That's it, and it's back to work tomorrow." Ryan Miller after clinching the North East division.


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fly as hale
PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 1:36 pm 
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Van_Da_Man wrote:
Why? What would 0-16 accomplish that 7-9 wouldn't? You know they won't draft the right players anyway.

I don't think he's a Bills fan, he just wants to see them suffer.

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ironyisadeadscene
PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 1:52 pm 
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no, im apathetic towards the bills. i was half kidding, i dont care what they do.

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patkane88
PostPosted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 10:32 pm 
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I am patient but I am not so patient to wait for a championship for many years like says the Cubs in MLB. Buffalo better win a cup before I die

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BlueandYellow
PostPosted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 4:07 am 
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The Bills look like a bunch of monkeys in uniform trying to butt fuck the ball.

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mechaphil
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:09 am 
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fly as hale wrote:
The smart one.

NYIntensity wrote:
I'm fine with losing Miller, bringing in a guy like Biron, who's CAPABLE, and then an all star. An all star goalie can't win you a cup, but sure as shit, a guy like Crosby can be clutch. Sure, we can make the argument that Miller's clutch and has stolen games, but when the team doesn't show up in front of him, he can't exactly take it on his shoulders to go score a goal. As I grow as a hockey fan, I feel as though I'm learning to appreciate the greatness of elite goalies but also, as I take off the homer glasses, realize that a great goalie isn't going to win you a championship. He's a great plan B. A fucking spectacular plan B. But he's still plan B.

Uhh, what makes you think a goalie like Biron is capable of winning a Cup? And what makes you think that losing Miller would mean that we would get an all star player that would get us a Cup? A great goalie isn't going to win you a championship? Where is the proof in that? Is a great goalie going to hurt your chances at a championship? Getting rid of Miller is a stupid idea.

People often cite the New Jersey Devils as the de-facto example of a team using a great goalie to win a championship, but it doesn't hold water. The Sabres had a great goalie in Dom Hasek, but he never won anything outside of individual awards in the NHL. The Devils, yes with Brodeur in net, also had clutch guys like Gomez, Elias, Pandolfo, Madden, Shanahan, Stevens, and a young Scott Niedermayer doing the battling. The Sabres don't have players that compare to those front-line and back-line troops, so leaning on Miller for everything will only 1)wear him out and 2)waste his prime.

If the Sabres can trade Miller for a superstar stud defenseman or a game-changing forward and sign a very, very good goaltender, I think they'd be in better shape. I'm in no way advocating trading Miller this off-season, but if I were GM and a quality trade offer came my way, I wouldn't flick it off my desk with a disapproving grunt like most fans would.

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jvaccaro6
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:16 am 
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mechaphil wrote:
fly as hale wrote:
The smart one.

NYIntensity wrote:
I'm fine with losing Miller, bringing in a guy like Biron, who's CAPABLE, and then an all star. An all star goalie can't win you a cup, but sure as shit, a guy like Crosby can be clutch. Sure, we can make the argument that Miller's clutch and has stolen games, but when the team doesn't show up in front of him, he can't exactly take it on his shoulders to go score a goal. As I grow as a hockey fan, I feel as though I'm learning to appreciate the greatness of elite goalies but also, as I take off the homer glasses, realize that a great goalie isn't going to win you a championship. He's a great plan B. A fucking spectacular plan B. But he's still plan B.

Uhh, what makes you think a goalie like Biron is capable of winning a Cup? And what makes you think that losing Miller would mean that we would get an all star player that would get us a Cup? A great goalie isn't going to win you a championship? Where is the proof in that? Is a great goalie going to hurt your chances at a championship? Getting rid of Miller is a stupid idea.

People often cite the New Jersey Devils as the de-facto example of a team using a great goalie to win a championship, but it doesn't hold water. The Sabres had a great goalie in Dom Hasek, but he never won anything outside of individual awards in the NHL. The Devils, yes with Brodeur in net, also had clutch guys like Gomez, Elias, Pandolfo, Madden, Shanahan, Stevens, and a young Scott Niedermayer doing the battling. The Sabres don't have players that compare to those front-line and back-line troops, so leaning on Miller for everything will only 1)wear him out and 2)waste his prime.

If the Sabres can trade Miller for a superstar stud defenseman or a game-changing forward and sign a very, very good goaltender, I think they'd be in better shape. I'm in no way advocating trading Miller this off-season, but if I were GM and a quality trade offer came my way, I wouldn't flick it off my desk with a disapproving grunt like most fans would.



The only way I'd even consider trading Miller would have to be a package like; Chara, Thomas, Savard; or Zetterberg, Howard, Kronwall, Eaves...and even those two trades I still feel like we're losing out.

Look at SJ, great team, pound for pound possibly the most talented roster in the league; but no goalie = no cups.

Another prime example of that, Philly. Now I fell in love with Mike Leighton late in the year, but lets face it, had they had a Ryan Miller in net, Pat Kane would be back in Buffalo beating on cabbies, and not on the tonight show.

Goaltending certainly doesn't win your a Stanley Cup, but it can sure lose you one.

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mechaphil
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:19 am 
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But without any troops to back-up the goaltender, you won't even get a sniff of the conference finals. I'm saying a great goalie with great troops in front (let's face it, Leighton is GOOD, but not GREAT) is a far better recipe for success than an all-world goalie with mediocre troops in front. Just ask Ryan Miller.

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BlueandYellow
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:22 am 
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jvaccaro6 wrote:
mechaphil wrote:
fly as hale wrote:
The smart one.

NYIntensity wrote:
I'm fine with losing Miller, bringing in a guy like Biron, who's CAPABLE, and then an all star. An all star goalie can't win you a cup, but sure as shit, a guy like Crosby can be clutch. Sure, we can make the argument that Miller's clutch and has stolen games, but when the team doesn't show up in front of him, he can't exactly take it on his shoulders to go score a goal. As I grow as a hockey fan, I feel as though I'm learning to appreciate the greatness of elite goalies but also, as I take off the homer glasses, realize that a great goalie isn't going to win you a championship. He's a great plan B. A fucking spectacular plan B. But he's still plan B.

Uhh, what makes you think a goalie like Biron is capable of winning a Cup? And what makes you think that losing Miller would mean that we would get an all star player that would get us a Cup? A great goalie isn't going to win you a championship? Where is the proof in that? Is a great goalie going to hurt your chances at a championship? Getting rid of Miller is a stupid idea.

People often cite the New Jersey Devils as the de-facto example of a team using a great goalie to win a championship, but it doesn't hold water. The Sabres had a great goalie in Dom Hasek, but he never won anything outside of individual awards in the NHL. The Devils, yes with Brodeur in net, also had clutch guys like Gomez, Elias, Pandolfo, Madden, Shanahan, Stevens, and a young Scott Niedermayer doing the battling. The Sabres don't have players that compare to those front-line and back-line troops, so leaning on Miller for everything will only 1)wear him out and 2)waste his prime.

If the Sabres can trade Miller for a superstar stud defenseman or a game-changing forward and sign a very, very good goaltender, I think they'd be in better shape. I'm in no way advocating trading Miller this off-season, but if I were GM and a quality trade offer came my way, I wouldn't flick it off my desk with a disapproving grunt like most fans would.



The only way I'd even consider trading Miller would have to be a package like; Chara, Thomas, Savard; or Zetterberg, Howard, Kronwall, Eaves...and even those two trades I still feel like we're losing out.

Look at SJ, great team, pound for pound possibly the most talented roster in the league; but no goalie = no cups.

Another prime example of that, Philly. Now I fell in love with Mike Leighton late in the year, but lets face it, had they had a Ryan Miller in net, Pat Kane would be back in Buffalo beating on cabbies, and not on the tonight show.

Goaltending certainly doesn't win your a Stanley Cup, but it can sure lose you one.


Nabokov isn't a good goalie? I think he is. Close to Miller.

And, I'm pretty sure Zetterburg, Howard, Kronwall, and Eaves for Miller is a BETTER deal for Buffalo.

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jvaccaro6
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:28 am 
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Yeah, but it's a building process...I mean, we've never had the luxury of picking in the top 5 in recent years, (2004, Vanek)

Look at Chicago, Toews, Kane 3rd and 1st overall respectively

Pittsburgh, Crosby, Fluery, Malkin, 1st overall, 1st overall, 2nd overall

I mean, I hate to be that guy, but if you draft that early, that many years in a row, you better win a fucking cup, you're getting very ELITE players at 1-5 overall. (with the Daigle exception)

Now scouting is much better than it was in the 80s and 90s as well. Technology makes it super easy to scout the entire globe and find these blue chip guys.

It's a process of building, I think right now, we are starting to put the right pieces in place. We have our Elite 2 way defender in Myers, we have our 40 goal scorer in Vanek. We have our shut down line in Goose Grier Kennedy, we have all the right pieces starting to fall. We still lack that elite secondary scorer, and we still need that PP QB, but the pieces are coming together.

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mechaphil
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:31 am 
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Would you move Miller is you could get back both that elite second-line scorer and the PP QB defenseman back in one package, then sign the best UFA goalie on the market?

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jvaccaro6
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:35 am 
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mechaphil wrote:
Would you move Miller is you could get back both that elite second-line scorer and the PP QB defenseman back in one package, then sign the best UFA goalie on the market?


Depends on who that goalie is...Nabokov? No; a guy like Bryzgalov or Backstrum, yeah probably.

You still need an upper echelon goalie to even be in the conversation in my opinion. I mean, I hate to say it, but I dont typically fall in love with players (Vanek, Drury and Doan are my exceptions) but if I were a GM, and I had the best goalie in the world on my roster, you'd have to come to the table with a sweet offer to pry him from my grasp.

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Jim Bob
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:35 am 
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mechaphil wrote:
Don't read much, do you? When the Hockey News puts out the results of a poll where the sample size are NHLers themselves that say Buffalo is the second-to-the-last city they want to play in, what's that tell you. Take your Regier-hating glasses off, it's unbecoming.


I've read the polls.

I also read Spacek's comments that said that he felt the same way before coming here.

So, you get guys like Rivet and Grier that are respected throughout the league to help sell the team.

You get Sabres alumni & ex-NHLers like Marcel Dionne who have made this area their home to help sell the team.

It makes it harder. But, it does not make it impossible.

Did you read the recent article about how the LA Kings are struggling to recruit UFAs to play there?

Locale isn't the only reason that UFAs look to sign places.

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mechaphil
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:36 am 
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Exactly. And that sweet offer would bolster the front ranks so that a slightly-lesser goalie is suitable enough. Bryzgalov is a UFA following this up-coming season, by the way ;)

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jvaccaro6
PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:40 am 
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mechaphil wrote:
Exactly. And that sweet offer would bolster the front ranks so that a slightly-lesser goalie is suitable enough. Bryzgalov is a UFA following this up-coming season, by the way ;)


Yeah; Bryz, and Backstrum are 2011 and 2012 respectively; both are viable options, but only for the right package. Something like a (Random 35 goal scorer on a decent contract) (Random defender who puts up 35-50 points) for Miller...I'd do it, if it were possible to land either of those two; but like I said, huge package to get the best goalie in the world. Not to mention the PR nightmare it would be trading him.

There are other factors that go into trades than just roster movement. How many people come to games because of Miller, how many do you lose on the business end of things, stuff like that. Thats why it's so hard to trade a star player, especially when he is the main draw for the media and the casual fans.

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Last edited by jvaccaro6 on Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

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