No need to call anyone a Nazi.

And yea, population growth is a huge problem, but unfortunately those of us interested in population control can't talk about it without the above happening. So we don't, cuz most people are dicks about it.

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mechaphil

This statement couldn't be less true. The average US citizen (me included) contributes more CO2 per capita than that of ANY other country. In fact, China just now surpassed the US as the world's biggest carbon polluter despite the fact that they have roughly 5 times the population of the US. That's including the environmental laws that have limited emissions in the US.

As to the "oh well, we're not gonna stop it" attitude, your'e a cop right? Well, crime is going to always exist. Do you think your actions can stop crime? No matter what you do, there will still be crime. So why not just throw your hands in the air and say "oh well"? That's basically the attitude you're giving on climate change. But you don't do that do you? Know why? Because you want to make the problem better despite the fact you won't be able to totally solve it. Pity you don't take that same attitude in this situation.

And how would you define 'overpopulation' ham?

I would define overpopulation as anything above sustainable. And on a global measure, not just a "there's extra food in the cupboard" standard of measure.

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If every American became carbon neutral today, nothing would change in the picture being painted by AGW "proponents".
It's already too late. Catastrophic climate change is a foregone conclusion.

While we're at it, the gulf of Mexico is about to implode and unleash a planet killing wave of toxic gasses.

I'm going to go home, have a juicy steak, a beer and say fuck-it-all.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

Seriously, Ham, calling you out on this one. You roll up in here to address someone's valid thoughts about the fact that the human race's population growth is a problem, and your only retort is to bust out a tired attack? Get over yourself.

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mechaphil

Talking about people like this guy.




It's called a condom, tell your stupid religion to stop hating them.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

Given the world's daily consumption of petroleum, the severe food and clean drinking water shortages, and the destruction of rain forests and the like by encroaching "civilization", and I'd say we're overpopulated for sure.

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mechaphil

Overpopulation is a very relative thing, in Ham's defense. Obviously there's enough food to feed everyone that's already here. And there's enough space. When I was in college I had a professor who once told us that you could take every person in the world, put them in standard suburban houses in families of 4-6, with small yards and everything, and they would all fit within the state of Texas.

Now, populations outgrowing their resources in other ways would be less easy to define. There are many historians who say that's exactly what happened to the people on Easter Island. But those historians are generally seen as endorsing the idea that people and their lifestyles affect the environment. As we know, that idea is apparently very controversial around here.

I don't take umbrage with Ham's idea that there might not be population overgrowth, but with the fact that he came out of nowhere and called Alex a Nazi just for suggesting that there's too much breeding going on (which, if there's population overgrowth, THERE IS).

Also, Stuu, that's not the first time I've heard the Texas theory but I can't remember where it was I heard it before.

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mechaphil

Our global economy and advanced technology is what allows modern society to have populations that outgrow their resources (see every major city on the planet).
I wouldn't out and out call that a bad thing.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

Well if you took the roughly 6,000,000,000 people and put them in houses of five on a half acre, you'd take up 937,500 square miles which is roughly 3.5 times the size of texas.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

Isn't the global economy in a bit of a shitty downswing at the moment, though? (save the strong Canadian dollar. Goddamn Canucks! lol)

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mechaphil

Ahh but I can still get resources that wouldn't be available to me naively in my location...like Taiwanese porn for example.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

There's a good chance you're gonna get a trap, so I'd stay away from that Taiwanese porn if I were you

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mechaphil

A half acre is pretty big for suburban living IMO. I said small yards. Of course I never bothered fact-checking this statement before repeating it so kudos on that.

Thought a half acre was pretty standard for suburbia.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

When in doubt, have Alex crunch the numbers and calculate the stats. He won't let ya down

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mechaphil

Tried to google the average suburban plot and came up empty. Not trying to bust your balls, I was just curious myself.



Alright, so a half acre is around 100 x 200 feet which isn't that much bigger than the land we had when we lived in an (end) townhouse. I'd guess we probably had something like 200 x 70 feet, so I think that's pretty standard for most housing developments.


I think I've heard if you took the population density of the densest county in NYC and applied that to the world, everyone would fit in Rhode Island.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

Like I said, global measure. (For clarification, we're on the same page).

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