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sabresindc
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:08 am 
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http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2010/10/26/2010-10-26_heroic_cop_feris_jones_who_shot_armed_robber_while_getting_hair_done_promoted_to.html

Either she is a horrible shot and got extremely lucky or the NYPD is now teaching movie tactics. The biggest issue I have is that the NYPD is promoting this woman by exploiting her "shooting prowess" and now everytime a NYPD officer shoots someone center mass (the way they are actually trained) and kills someone this WILL be brought up on the wrongful death suit.....

Quote:
When Jones fired five shots at the gunman - knocking the gun down and also blowing the salon doorknob off, trapping him inside - it was the first time she had fired in the line of duty in 20 years on the job.

"When the moment called for it," Bloomberg said, "she was primed, prepared and precise."


Quote:
Unfazed, Jones used her own NYPD-issued Smith & Wesson five-shot pistol to shoot the gun right out of Cox's hands.

She hit his right middle finger and grazed his left hand, cops said.

One of the five shots hit the knob of the automatic lock on the front door, disabling it and effectively trapping Cox, Browne said.[/b]

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gr8daygo
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:14 am 
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yeah right... she closed her eyes and popped off 5 rounds and got lucky...lol... id like to see how much time she has spent at the range in 20 years on the force... Im not in law enforcement, but i shoot a lot, and thats pretty precise for a revolver... and to your point, every law enforcement person Ive talked to says the same thing... as you did, center mass, you shoot to kill if your going to pull...

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Squanto
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:23 am 
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Based on my experience with law enforcement during my EMS days,and knowing how they generally operate when it comes to media reports, I'm pretty sure that this story is complete embellishment by the NYPD.

Shooting the gun out of her hand means that she missed. The magic bullet that jammed the door was also a miss. She's lucky that she didn't get popped herself, and didn't get anyone else killed.

She popped up 5 rounds, and clipped him enough to make him drop his gun.


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Rutledge222
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:26 am 
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gr8daygo wrote:
yeah right... she closed her eyes and popped off 5 rounds and got lucky...lol... id like to see how much time she has spent at the range in 20 years on the force... Im not in law enforcement, but i shoot a lot, and thats pretty precise for a revolver... and to your point, every law enforcement person Ive talked to says the same thing... as you did, center mass, you shoot to kill if your going to pull...



This. Completely agree. She got lucky, it would be so hard to do what she did on purpose. Ill give her props cuz she did what she did, but she did not in any way do it on purpose. Honestly I do not see why she got promoted to Detective, I think that is kinda bullshit, you do something on accident and get lucky and then bam you are promoted? No, that is not how things should be done, hell think about it? If one of those bullets went stray and hit someone out side of the salon? Ya then she would be fucked sideways... it is total bullshit.

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sabresindc
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:30 am 
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gr8daygo wrote:
yeah right... she closed her eyes and popped off 5 rounds and got lucky...lol... id like to see how much time she has spent at the range in 20 years on the force... Im not in law enforcement, but i shoot a lot, and thats pretty precise for a revolver... and to your point, every law enforcement person Ive talked to says the same thing... as you did, center mass, you shoot to kill if your going to pull...

Not exactly shoot to kill but shoot to stop the threat (which you can interpret whatever way you want). I understand praising her for confronting the assailant but to make it sound like she meant to do this.....
Quote:
"This is a story that will be told at the Police Department for many years to come," said Mayor Bloomberg, who praised Jones' "incredible bravery and marksmanship."


The first part is correct, they will be talking about in the police dept on what not to do....

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Rutledge222
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:34 am 
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Markmanship? no, i seriously highly doubt that. Show me how many times she was at the range, if she went anywhere from 4-5 times a week for the 20 years she didnt ever shoot that gun then maybe. But if she said she never used her gun before in the line of duty then why would anyone be convinced that she did it on purpose? Its bull shit, you shoot the "suspect/offender" in the center mass. do not aim for the gun or the door handle, total bullshit. I am telling you if one stray bullet from her hit someone else then she would be so screwed.

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sabresindc
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:35 am 
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Rutledge222 wrote:
gr8daygo wrote:
yeah right... she closed her eyes and popped off 5 rounds and got lucky...lol... id like to see how much time she has spent at the range in 20 years on the force... Im not in law enforcement, but i shoot a lot, and thats pretty precise for a revolver... and to your point, every law enforcement person Ive talked to says the same thing... as you did, center mass, you shoot to kill if your going to pull...



This. Completely agree. She got lucky, it would be so hard to do what she did on purpose. Ill give her props cuz she did what she did, but she did not in any way do it on purpose. Honestly I do not see why she got promoted to Detective, I think that is kinda bullshit, you do something on accident and get lucky and then bam you are promoted? No, that is not how things should be done, hell think about it? If one of those bullets went stray and hit someone out side of the salon? Ya then she would be fucked sideways... it is total bullshit.

It's explained in the article. The NYPD has been know to promote people for "battlefield heroics" and that is what she did. I'm happy to see that she actually did confront the asshole but they really should not exploited her shooting skill or lack there of. Doesn't mean she knows what she is doing when it comes to investigations but she gets a pretty gold badge and a pay raise.

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sabresindc
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:39 am 
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You know that lawyers are drooling over this....They can not wait till another NYPD officer shoots someone center mass just so they can throw this in their faces. They really fucked cops everywhere now. Just read someone of the friggin comments at the end of the article....its going to be in NYC now for cops

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sabretoothpick wrote:
Yhoshi wrote:
wollt ihr die sabres oben sehen müsst ihr die tabelle drehn.

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Squanto
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:39 am 
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I have no problem with the promotion. I have a problem with the assertion that she pulled some Matrix style shots off intentionally.


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Rutledge222
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:40 am 
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sabresindc wrote:
Rutledge222 wrote:
gr8daygo wrote:
yeah right... she closed her eyes and popped off 5 rounds and got lucky...lol... id like to see how much time she has spent at the range in 20 years on the force... Im not in law enforcement, but i shoot a lot, and thats pretty precise for a revolver... and to your point, every law enforcement person Ive talked to says the same thing... as you did, center mass, you shoot to kill if your going to pull...



This. Completely agree. She got lucky, it would be so hard to do what she did on purpose. Ill give her props cuz she did what she did, but she did not in any way do it on purpose. Honestly I do not see why she got promoted to Detective, I think that is kinda bullshit, you do something on accident and get lucky and then bam you are promoted? No, that is not how things should be done, hell think about it? If one of those bullets went stray and hit someone out side of the salon? Ya then she would be fucked sideways... it is total bullshit.

It's explained in the article. The NYPD has been know to promote people for "battlefield heroics" and that is what she did. I'm happy to see that she actually did confront the asshole but they really should not exploited her shooting skill or lack there of. Doesn't mean she knows what she is doing when it comes to investigations but she gets a pretty gold badge and a pay raise.


Then that is incompetence from the NYPD. Sure she did her duty like she was supposed to. BUT the part of the story that bugs me is HOW she did it, not because she did something "heroic".

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Rutledge222
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:41 am 
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Squanto wrote:
I have no problem with the promotion. I have a problem with the assertion that she pulled some Matrix style shots off intentionally.


That is basically what I am getting at. Good that she apprehended a criminal but in all honesty, how she did it was completely unprofessional and she still got the promotion. That is what bugs me.

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Squanto
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:44 am 
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I disagree it was unprofessional. She tried to protect the civilians, and did her best to neutralize the perp. She succeeded in both. That's to be commended.


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Sabresfansince1980
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:53 am 
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I can't totally criticize the officer, because the story I read said that she first identified herself as NYPD and the suspect then started firing first. She could have handled it differently at first, but once that happened the best response is to shoot center mass and "stop the threat" like DC said. She got lucky to have stopped the threat without getting herself or anyone else killed.

As starved NYPD is for good publicity, it's no surprise that they are trumping this up into some hero story. I don't know that they are setting themselves up for future criticism (that stuff is gonna happen no matter what) but the whole thing is transparent enough for most to see it's nothing more than PR. Stupid, retarded PR. It's my understanding that being assigned as a detective in NYPD is only a transfer, not a promotion. Most agencies don't consider a detective spot as a promotion. It's all part of the PR bs, but it's also a small, genuine gesture of appreciation to an officer for not totally screwing up or causing another major lawsuit. Make no mistake though, if she truly was proficient with a gun, the suspect would've been dead on the floor.


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BlueandYellow
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 12:26 pm 
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Why is this becoming a contest? She did something heroic... Who cares if she missed? "Daw she got lucky. She isn't as good as me!"

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NYIntensity
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 12:39 pm 
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It's not a contest. What NYPD basically said is that with proper training, officers are able to accurately and efficiently discharge their firearms in a nonlethal manner in order to de-escalate a situation.

I wouldn't describe what she did as heroic. She did what she gets paid to do. I'm a bit stingy on handing out the hero label though; if you know me, you know why.

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sabresindc
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:13 pm 
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Sabresfansince1980 wrote:
I can't totally criticize the officer, because the story I read said that she first identified herself as NYPD and the suspect then started firing first. She could have handled it differently at first, but once that happened the best response is to shoot center mass and "stop the threat" like DC said. She got lucky to have stopped the threat without getting herself or anyone else killed.

As starved NYPD is for good publicity, it's no surprise that they are trumping this up into some hero story. I don't know that they are setting themselves up for future criticism (that stuff is gonna happen no matter what) but the whole thing is transparent enough for most to see it's nothing more than PR. Stupid, retarded PR. It's my understanding that being assigned as a detective in NYPD is only a transfer, not a promotion. Most agencies don't consider a detective spot as a promotion. It's all part of the PR bs, but it's also a small, genuine gesture of appreciation to an officer for not totally screwing up or causing another major lawsuit. Make no mistake though, if she truly was proficient with a gun, the suspect would've been dead on the floor.

I am happy to see that she acted and not so much upset about the PR but the way it's being spun. You know that there are a loud portion of this country that believe that police officers should shoot to wound or disable(legs, arms, etc)or to shoot at the weapon. A police department promoting this type of action is just going to cause this sentiment to possibly snowball. Especially when one of their officers actually shoots center mass and kills someone. I'm shocked that this isn't on every national news media.

As with the detective spot. In NYPD there are a few different levels of detective and they are all a type of promotion or pay increase. Just because she has a detectives' shield doesn't mean she will actually be an investigator. She'll probably just go back to her normal assignment in uniform.

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sabresindc
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:24 pm 
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NYIntensity wrote:
It's not a contest. What NYPD basically said is that with proper training, officers are able to accurately and efficiently discharge their firearms in a nonlethal manner in order to de-escalate a situation.

That's the the issue. There is no way that any police department firearms instruction taught her to de-escalate a situation by shooting the gun out of the assailants hand or by shooting the lock off of a door. Police Officers are trained in every agency in this country to shoot center mass

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slesh
PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 4:47 pm 
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Squanto wrote:
Based on my experience with law enforcement during my EMS days,and knowing how they generally operate when it comes to media reports, I'm pretty sure that this story is complete embellishment by the NYPD.

Shooting the gun out of her hand means that she missed. The magic bullet that jammed the door was also a miss. She's lucky that she didn't get popped herself, and didn't get anyone else killed.

She popped up 5 rounds, and clipped him enough to make him drop his gun.

You are correct Squanto. She popped off 5 rounds. That in itself is scary given it took 5 shots to "knock the gun out of his hand" and "shoot the door knob off to prevent escape".

Smell a little fishy considering she hadn't used her weapon in the line of duty (i.e. high stress, high pressure situations) in 20 years.

Ya, I'll go along and say "she got lucky", but then again, even if it is scary, I love the fact that she did it and I applaud her courage and sense of duty to read and react to the situation.

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