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Markus
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:01 am 
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X-pensfan wrote:
playa00, That's a good observation, Stafford, Vanek, Boyes, Connolly always let up on the hitting. A lot Sabres forwards don't like to finish their checks on the forecheck and that is a big reason why they don't have a good forecheck.

When you hit, a lot of good things can happen. D-man falls down, rushes a pass next time, losses his stick, gets wore out, etc. McCormick and Grier could not make up the forecheck hittint for the entire team.

Especially in the playoffs, you have to finish your checks. And if you don't want to do that, you wont win the Cup.

The Sabres need to find more guys willing to skate through a wall for the Cup.


I agree 100%.

Watch other teams play in the playoffs. Almost every single player, even the little guys, even the scorers, will deliver a hit when it's there for the taking.

Boyes, Vanek, Connolly, Pommers almost ALWAYS let up.

Look at Briere. He has the body that couldn't intimidate a pancake and he still hit during the playoffs, a lot.

They need to get angry.


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Jammerz04
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:07 am 
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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
My MVPs in green and my LVPs in red along with good and bad figures in the appropriate color.

Image


Kind of sucks when only one player out of the 23 who played at least one game has a + Rating.

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X-pensfan
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:38 am 
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Markus wrote:
X-pensfan wrote:
playa00, That's a good observation, Stafford, Vanek, Boyes, Connolly always let up on the hitting. A lot Sabres forwards don't like to finish their checks on the forecheck and that is a big reason why they don't have a good forecheck.

When you hit, a lot of good things can happen. D-man falls down, rushes a pass next time, losses his stick, gets wore out, etc. McCormick and Grier could not make up the forecheck hittint for the entire team.

Especially in the playoffs, you have to finish your checks. And if you don't want to do that, you wont win the Cup.

The Sabres need to find more guys willing to skate through a wall for the Cup.



you know what they say about nice guys.

Time to bring in some nasty, mean, physical, players.
I agree 100%.

Watch other teams play in the playoffs. Almost every single player, even the little guys, even the scorers, will deliver a hit when it's there for the taking.

Boyes, Vanek, Connolly, Pommers almost ALWAYS let up.

Look at Briere. He has the body that couldn't intimidate a pancake and he still hit during the playoffs, a lot.

They need to get angry.

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jordano
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:41 am 
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bigC24 wrote:
Wow... Vanek gets 5 goals and finishes a -7??? That is absolutely awful in every way.

Four of Vanek's goals were on the powerplay, which does not count as a + to your stat.

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patkane88
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:43 am 
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I think they got out coached once again by a Peter Laviolette team but, they played with pretty much a joke of a defense and way too many injuries.

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patkane88
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:48 am 
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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
My MVPs in green and my LVPs in red along with good and bad figures in the appropriate color.

Image



I'd like to know your reasoning for not putting any red on Staffords goal total, he played like a total piece of shit the whole playoff and was a complete non factor and he needed to be.

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Skyline_BNR34
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:51 am 
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Injuries killed us, lack of a physical presence in game 7 killed us also. Blown leads killed us. We didn't get fully outplayed this series bit game seven we did. We always let down in the second instead of continuing to do what we needed to do to win and the person I'm going to blame for that is our coaching staff. You are up 3 or 2 goals after the first don't play a fucking defensive shell of a game. They got burned everytime they tried that.

Hate to say it, but lindy ruff should not be back behind the Sabres bench next year. Cut the cord and get someone who is willing to always motivate a team to play to win.

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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
No need for violence, just tell her she's got a game misconduct and show her the door.

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As I said in the GDT, the call on Rivet was horseshit. The Bruins player was holding onto Rivet's stick like it was the last fucking raft on the Titanic.


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Stuuuuuuu
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 11:50 am 
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Injuries were a problem for the Flyers too who played more or less without their best defender in Pronger, and played most of the series without one of their best forwards in Carter.

Blown leads were the killer. I'm still not sure how or why the team was able to play good 1st periods in most games then totally fall apart in the 2nd & 3rd.

I feel that Miller was not on some other level above the rest of the team. He played one of the best games of his career in this series, but at other times he was nothing more than average. 1 or 2 great games do not make up for an inconsistent series IMO, and Miller shares the blame for this loss as much any other Sabre. So I guess I disagree with your labeling of Miller as one of the heroes CV, and with Squanto's assertion that Miller was the reason it went to 7 games.


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Squanto
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 11:56 am 
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I respect what you're saying, I just don't agree with the logic that says :

Miller lets in <2 = good game!!
Miller lets in >2 = BAD GAME!!

But that seems to be the common refrain. Miller is crucified for every goal he allows, even when there are legitimate reasons you can point to another player being the culprit, or the opponent simply making a good play.

It's an absurd standard that no goalie who has ever lived can meet.


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PatGreen
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 11:57 am 
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unless hasek is like a virus. not alive, yet not dead....hmmm


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Stuuuuuuu
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 12:05 pm 
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Squanto wrote:
I respect what you're saying, I just don't agree with the logic that says :

Miller lets in <2 = good game!!
Miller lets in >2 = BAD GAME!!

But that seems to be the common refrain. Miller is crucified for every goal he allows, even when there are legitimate reasons you can point to another player being the culprit, or the opponent simply making a good play.

It's an absurd standard that no goalie who has ever lived can meet.

I wouldn't say that's my standard. Miller let in 4 or more goals 4 times in this series. Even if the defense threw him to the dogs for a lot of this series, those stats tell me he let in at least some goals he should have stopped.


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Squanto
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 12:25 pm 
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I guess we just differ there.

I don't look at the stats and just assume some of those goals were cupcakes. I need to see to goals, see the plays as they developed, see what happened. I think my standards of a cupcake goal are different than most too.


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Stuuuuuuu
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 12:34 pm 
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Many of the goals he had no chance to stop. At least 2 though were long range slapshots, and I'm not talking about the one at the end of the first period last night that went off Grier's hand.


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Squanto
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 12:42 pm 
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Stuuuuuuu wrote:
Many of the goals he had no chance to stop. At least 2 though were long range slapshots, and I'm not talking about the one at the end of the first period last night that went off Grier's hand.


I'd generally agree with that. I'm not saying Miller was perfect this series. He wasn't. There were a couple goals in the early games that were smelly in my view.

I just don't think that there were so many more than most other top end goaltenders would have given up based on my my experiences watching the game over the years.


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ironyisadeadscene
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 1:05 pm 
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im not blaming anyone in particular, the sabres took a good team to 7 games. this bodes well for the future, especially should darcy get the right players this off season.

im still really bummed, but hopefully "justified" will make me feel better tonight. that show is AWESOME!

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X-pensfan
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:36 pm 
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Miller only let in one soft goal in the entire series. Sure there were a few that I've seen him stop in the past but only one that I thought to myself, "that was soft". And that was a somewhat meaningless goal to Leino and HE COULD NOT have shot a puck any better than that. Still, from that angle the goalie should be able to make a routine save if he's in position.

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ironyisadeadscene
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:42 pm 
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im going to say it. but read the whole post.

if i were darcy, id dangle miller out there this summer. i mean, i wouldnt trade him unless the oilers offered up their first overall (never happen) or anahiem said, here, take ryan getzlaf, or a younger, elite player in return. but i'd see what was what on the landscape.

by no means do i blame miller for the series, and i do believe he is an elite goalie. but if you somehow get a younger, impact player in return...

of course, this will never happen, nor do i want it to happen.. im just thinkin out loud, i guess.

flame away!

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BlueandYellow
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:47 pm 
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ironyisadeadscene wrote:
im going to say it. but read the whole post.

if i were darcy, id dangle miller out there this summer. i mean, i wouldnt trade him unless the oilers offered up their first overall (never happen) or anahiem said, here, take ryan getzlaf, or a younger, elite player in return. but i'd see what was what on the landscape.

by no means do i blame miller for the series, and i do believe he is an elite goalie. but if you somehow get a younger, impact player in return...

of course, this will never happen, nor do i want it to happen.. im just thinkin out loud, i guess.

flame away!

I fully agree, man. I love Miller and all, but if we could get some young superstar...

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X-pensfan
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:57 pm 
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ironyisadeadscene wrote:
im going to say it. but read the whole post.

if i were darcy, id dangle miller out there this summer. i mean, i wouldnt trade him unless the oilers offered up their first overall (never happen) or anahiem said, here, take ryan getzlaf, or a younger, elite player in return. but i'd see what was what on the landscape.

by no means do i blame miller for the series, and i do believe he is an elite goalie. but if you somehow get a younger, impact player in return...

of course, this will never happen, nor do i want it to happen.. im just thinkin out loud, i guess.

flame away!



That's still a very young defense. Weber, Myers, Sekera, and Gragnani are all very good but they still need some more experience. So I don't think now is the time to start going the route the Flyers have and going with who sucks the least in net. Maybe when his contract is up you take a good hard look at the economic landscape and weigh your options then. I think they need to find another solid stay at home top 4 defense man to upgrade Montador with.

They need more aggressive physical play from their forwards. The Sabres need to start building a team that wants to play 60% of the game in the o-zone instead of 60% in the d-zone. If they do that, the goal-tending and the defense improve by default. But to do that you have to be the aggressor, the more aggressive team. They should take a good hard look at some of their core forwards and see if they want to trade one or two of them. I think some of the guys they have now will finish their checks if that's what is called for, but the mindset right now is not to finish them and that's because too many Sabres forwards play the same low contact style. And they don't want to deal with the scrum bullshit. Well, that has to change some.

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Stuuuuuuu
 Post subject: Re: Blame Who You Will
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:58 pm 
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ironyisadeadscene wrote:
im going to say it. but read the whole post.

if i were darcy, id dangle miller out there this summer. i mean, i wouldnt trade him unless the oilers offered up their first overall (never happen) or anahiem said, here, take ryan getzlaf, or a younger, elite player in return. but i'd see what was what on the landscape.

by no means do i blame miller for the series, and i do believe he is an elite goalie. but if you somehow get a younger, impact player in return...

of course, this will never happen, nor do i want it to happen.. im just thinkin out loud, i guess.

flame away!

Nothing wrong with exploring all your options. The guy is a top ten, maybe top 5 goalie, but he ain't Hasek. If you can make the team better by trading Miller, then by all means do it.

Having said that though, if they did trade Miller, they wouldn't be able to find a goalie that's a better value as far as cap hit IMO.

Of course I'm sure that's not what you're saying. You're saying that you'd be willing to see the Sabres' goaltending become worse if that meant that another aspect of the team improved more than the amount they would lose in goaltending. Nothing wrong with that. I just don't know if it's possible or at least very probable that that would happen.


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