All of you saying that Vanek isn't very vocal, does that truly matter?

Is Jonathan Toews vocal? Is Sidney Crosby vocal? Those are two guys that have won Stanley Cups whom I just don't see as being very vocal whatsoever.

Those guys lead by example. They score goals, and they create plays that make goals, much like Vanek does, and always has.

Vanek has also shown that he's ready to put a leadership role on his plate. I've never seen him play better than when Lindy put the A on his sweater.

I don't think family has much to do with it, either. Here's a list of some good, well known captains with wives and families:

Zdeno Chara
Nicklas Lidstrom
Steve Yzerman
Scott Niedermayer
Joe Thornton
Joe Sakic

If anything, I'd think having a family only strengthens one's role as captain.

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Girgensons for captain. Team Keep Nick DesLauriers forever.

@TJLuckman550

Having a family really doesn't matter. But being vocal is VERY important. If you're a captain, you're supposed to keep your squad in line. I remember reading a story, I don't remember the captain, but the story was about a captain who made his squad do laps, due to a poor performance on the ice. His team flourished from that. I like to see that in a captain. Someone who controls his squad.

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"Counting all the assholes in the room, I'm definitely not alone!" ~ Michael Poulsen, Volbeat, Still Standing.

Toews and Crosby aren't vocal? What???? If you watch a game or attend a Blackhawks/Pens game you will see them chatting and directing all game.

Vanek isn't that guy and maybe he doesn't need to be to achieve the C but if he wants to be a captain we remember he has to be a leader beyond what he's done the past few seasons.

Example: as bitchy Crosby can be, he gets in the corners, wins some battles, brings his team together and will even get in some fights once in awhile, even if it starts with a cheapshot.

Ideal change: instead of watching a player get whacked with a stick and punched in the face and you just put your head down like a sad puppy, you should actually push back and stand up for your guys.

Vanek will have atleast 3 seasons to prove himself at that spot.

You know, that's an excellent question. I don't think being vocal is something a good leader has to be. I definitely think they can lead by quiet example, and if they have the right personality, that leading by quiet example can be even more effective than some verbal tirade. Although this may not be a truly similar situation, I myself have taken on the "leadership" role in a few of the bands I've played in over the years. Whatever rants, speeches, or verbal explosions you might have, words really can only do so much, and words lose their power and effectiveness after a certain threshold. At that point by being vocal you just become a nag, bitch, hardass, or whatever, and it becomes easier to tune you out. At those points I think just going about your business in the most professional way possible with your mouth shut is infinitely more effective than being vocal.

Now what I do worry about in that regard with Vanek is that when he's not scoring, you can see him get visibly frustrated by it. He gets down on himself, and I know that in sports, feeling defeated is just a small step from (and usually the one right before) actually being defeated. So that's why I have doubts about Vanek as captain. But honestly, I'm not sure there is a Sabre on the current roster that could be a better combination of verbal and on-ice, lead-by-example, leadership.

VF26 -

Being vocal maybe doesn't matter in all cases, but it's better for a C to be that way than not. As for family, of course other Cs have family, but Vanek has I think three children including two new twins. Is that a deciding factor? No, but stuff like that takes away from having full attention on the team off the ice. It's just a potential issue to consider, nothing more.

I like Vanek a lot...always have and always thought of him as a player that puts a lot of pressure on himself because he truly cares, regardless of what some fans think of his on-ice effort. Does that mean he's the best option for C? Not necessarily. Does who wears the C really matter a whole lot in the long run? That's debatable too. I really don't care much about it because team effort and dedication to details will make a much bigger difference than a letter.

I've played with both vocal and non-vocal captains. Both kinds of people can be an effective leader.

That's why I get annoyed with all these topics about who fans think the captains should be. Unless you know the dynamics in the room, you don't really know what kind of captain works.

I'm talking what he should be on the ice and on the bench. As I said before, there is very little chance that anyone on this board knows what happens in the dressing room.

But I think we can take from what we see on the bench as an indication that Vanek probably doesn't lead the team with a war dance.

It could work, and I'm sure we are all rooting for it. I just want to see him do more leadership wise. I don't think any of his past seasons have been captain worthy.

How can you say that you don't know what goes on in the room, yet then say Vanek doesn't have what it takes?

i think i agree with vanek having it

C: Vanek
A: Gaustad
A: Roy
A: Hecht
A: Pominville

(i know i have four, i suspect there will be rotating A's. the ones i like are the first two is we only have two)

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I was referring to on ice. And I didn't really say that, as I want and expect him to be captain.

But he does lack Certain things that many captains throughout the league have.

Like I've said, it's going to be up to what he does this season. When HR wears the C, maybe those "he doesn't have to" comments will stop.

As a captain, in my opinion, your ability is supposed to support multiple aspects of the game, not just scoring goals.

Edit: multiple iPhone autocorrect mistakes, forgive me.

Enough with the vagaries. List them.

I believe I already did, but if you'd like me to i'll be glad. I mentioned how a captain usually is a stronger force than the rest of the squad, both mentally and physically. He is meant to be stood up for, but also his role is to stand up for his team and lead them. A captain should play almost everywhere on the ice, in the corners and in the hard spots that may not be ideal for scoring, but get the job done.

Even the league wide "wimpy" captains have gotten into fights, get into scrums and go beyond putting a puck into a wide open net. Captain usually does not = best goal scorer on the team.

I mean I HATE the compare game, because people will throw out any old name, so I hate to use it for my argument, but think of guys like Chara, Iginla, Toews, Crosby, Doan, Lidstrom, Staal, Brown, Weber, Ladd...etc...

Do we think he really matches up with those guys? Each and every single one of those players, throughout the years, have had multiple elements to their games, and have been EFFECTIVE at even strength situations, where Vanek does not excel.

Now as I said before, i do think he should be our captain, because to be honest, we don't have any other better candidates as of now. It seems i've been baited into this argument, and I even agree with what most of you are saying. But yes, a captain should be vocal at some point. I don't know many captains in this league that sit on the bench with their heads down.

And I thought, respectfully, that this is a message board, and we are fans that can comment on what we see the game as. Don't you ever get tired of that "we cannot speculate nor assume" argument? We are not robots, we have opinions. I think we can make a pretty damn decent assumption that Vanek doesn't lead them into chant or speech in the locker room.

So I guess if I see Vanek wearing the C, I want him to change. No more just watching while another player gets slashed or cheapshotted and just putting your head down and skating to the bench slowly. I know the counter argument is going to be "but 5 minutes, we need Vanek!" Well, other captains in the league stand up for their teams, I will expect the same from Vanek, and I don't think that's too much to ask.

So, in general, you consider on-ice performance to be a more important factor than other others? That's probably where I disagree with you most.



There are things that are reasonable to speculate and assume about. You can watch the game, see what goes on, and form opinions about that. I have no problem with that.

What I do have a problem with is speculation that isn't based on something observable. It's impossible for anyone to watch the games and interviews, but somehow know what the interpersonal relationships are between the players, and what goes in behind closed doors in the locker room. It's impossible to know that, or even to draw reasonable inferences from. I've played with guys that are GREAT in the locker room and off the ice, but during a game, I'd like to spear them in the face.

You have nothing to base your assumption on that Vanek isn't a vocal locker room guy. You just assume that he isn't because of how he acts on the bench from time to time. This is the stuff that frustrates me, and frankly, the stuff that makes me not want to participate in message boards. I prefer to deal with opinions that are grounded in substance, not ones that are just pulled from thin air. Seems like more people here prefer the latter.

This entire argument of 'Well, it's a message board, it's for opinions' is played out as well. Yes, you can give your opinions. However, others have the right to respond to that opinion in a way with which you may not agree.

Agreed, but my point is as a fan we have to take everything that we see, from his play or actions on the ice and the bench, to his interviews in the locker room, as atleast an indication of our opinion of him.

For example, from what we know about Trent Edwards, and from what I had heard from people somewhat close to the organization, we can assume when they're all ready to take the field he's not the most vocal. I mean that team is missing a true leader as well, but I don't think Trent went into a frenzy before games during his tenure. And if he did, it probably wasn't very good.

Either way, most of what i'm talking about in this thread is his presence outside of the locker room. Standing up for players, being a strong leader, and doing what it takes to try to win games.

Example: Vanek is about as "clutch" as Drury was with goals, however, when the game was on the line, in any situation, you'd want Drury out there. Whether we were down by one, tied, or up by one, Drury would be the man to go to AND he would almost always be involved with the play, win or lose.

To me, Vanek is a completely different player. He may score that goal that wins us the game....or he may be the most unnoticed person in the entire building.

Even the small captains in this league usually stand up for their teammates in bad situations. Vanek has size, he has to prove himself. My point is if he continues what he has been doing the last few seasons, he's not exactly captain worthy. I do believe we should give him the C to see if his play changes and see if he becomes the player he should be.

Rewatch the entire season and see how many times the opposing goalie has covered the puck, a scrum ensues and Vanek puts his head down, slowly skates to the bench while the other 2 forwards on our team get mauled by 5 (or 6) players. That to me, needs to change.

I don't know why any fan of this team wouldn't want Vanek to do more. We don't want a Yashin/Satan type captain, we want a fearless Vanek.

I think the captain should be the best overall player. I mean, players that dominate more than one aspect of the game. I don't know much about the players personally so I can't really say who the captain should be.

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"Counting all the assholes in the room, I'm definitely not alone!" ~ Michael Poulsen, Volbeat, Still Standing.

If we go with Vanek it's either gonna be hit or miss. Either he takes it as a sign of trust and plays like a beast, or he puts too much pressure on himself to perform that he chokes. I have a small problem giving it to Roy after what we did when he went down. He's a great player who definitely deserves consideration but my vote goes to Pomms. He's arguably our best two-way forward and will play in every situation. I'd love to see more production obviously but quite honestly he's not that big of a detriment to our offence. I don't see Pomms as a guy to put pressure on himself if he were given the role. To me he seems like the guy who's just going to keep playing his game no matter what.
C - Pomms
Home A - Myers Vanek
Road A - Roy Goose

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Driver of the Tyler Ennis Bandwagon, Ridin' shotgun on the Tyler Myers Bandwagon, chillin' on the Luke Adam Bandwagon


Eh

I don't think we will have a true captain for another 3 to 4 years, unless of course Regehr becomes a leader on this team.

Waiting for Myers or Adam to take that role.

C - Vanek

Away
A - Stafford
A - Pominville

Home or permanent
A - Regehr
A - Gaustad

that's what i would do

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"Tis The Season, Fa la la la la LaFontaine" - Rick Jeanneret

Derek Roy.

C - Vanek
A - Regher
A - Gaustad

Do. It.

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