Sean Avery was born a douche that's irrelevant.

I'm thinking it's the other way around...the guys with anger problems become enforcers

There's been fighting in hockey for a hundred years.
You're taking a really big leap with this assertion.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

The systemic pussifycation of the modern (especially urban) male cannot be denied.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

Fighting has been a part of hockey for a hundred years. Now, I'd like to know the answer to this, but I'm pretty sure the role of career fighter, a "goon" who gets his roster spot mainly through his fists instead of his hockey skill, is not 100 years old. Anybody know the history there? Did the Wings have somebody around to protect Gordie Howe all the time like the Oilers and Kings did with Gretzky?

I can only speak to what I know, but goons/enforcers have been around since at least the 70's...we can agree on that.
There weren't hockey players committing suicide in alarming numbers for the last 30 years that I've been paying attention.

If this were a symptom of the game or roles changing, surely we would have seen a gradual increase in incidents, not several all at once.

IMO this is just a really sad coincidence and probably nothing more...but we'll probably never know.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

According to the Centers for Disease Control suicide rates rise and fall with the economy. The greatest single sustained period of increase in suicides was during the early years of the Great Depression (back when "men were men"). The suicide rate fell dramatically between 1991 and 2001 (the age of the girly-men, right?), when the economy was strong and there were low rates of unemployment.

Men are four times as likely to commit suicide as women. Currently, suicide rates for men in the military (no doubt our "manliest men") are higher than the civilian population and are at the highest levels since they began keeping records.

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th' only knower of th' cosmic mysteries alive at this time

I can use google.
http://yourlife.usatoday.com/health/med ... 46173976/1
some points you left out of your paraphrasing.

So your military emphasis seems in doubt.

A factor which does not change with the economy.
90%

And to clarify, I never said suicide statistics were in any way tied to being manly or not.
Our grandfathers were more badass than we are. It's a fact you can enjoy with your chai latte.

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Hold my beer and watch this...

Personally I feel that the problem (if there is one since I don't think any of the deaths can directly be linked to issues accumulated through fighting) isn't fighting itself, but the enforcer role in general. I believe that fighting has a purpose in hockey, but it seems letting guys like Belak (9), Rypien (11), and Boogard (15) rack up that many fights per season for an extended period of time is not good at best. I wouldn't mind the NHL placing a limit on the number of fights a player can accumulate over the course of the season and suspending for the rest of the season if they cross that line. Of course, actually enforcing rules would help the problem by way of eliminating retribution fights.

Manliness is arbitrary, it has no concrete definition.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

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Hold my beer and watch this...

Okay one thing that has really set me off with these deaths are idiots like georges Laraque and Tyson Nash say it's the NHLPA's fault that they don't offer help when you retire from playing hockey. Really?? If you have mental problems how does that have anything to do with the NHLPA and the NHL??

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just call me Brad

Twitter @BUrbanowicz13

this is gold



15 fights probably is about 30 punches. that isn't very many. rob ray used to take that many and give out twice as much per week (sarcasm). either way, taking a couple dozen punches a year isn't a big deal. those guys don't hit comparably hard to MMA or boxing, and probably don't hit a lot harder than a college player (keep in mind, their jerseys are usually tied up, restraining movement).

manliness isn't that arbitrary, there are some pretty good guidelines.

Because there's a pretty clear link between repeated concussions and depression.

Until the culture of sport changes such that playing through and hiding injuries is perceived to make you tough and awesome, these things will continue to happen.

playing through injuries is awesome. ask mike modano.

i love playing injured myself. i always seemed to player better when i was hurt/sick/drunk.

shit, i had a shutout in the yeast infection game. most miserable shut out ever though.

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There is a difference I think in playing through pain and playing through injuries.

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Proud LGBTQQ Individual

An important distinction that sometimes players are not able to make.

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th' only knower of th' cosmic mysteries alive at this time

the onus is on them, they are adults.

There isn't a player in the league that will admit to depression, or any other mental issues, while playing. They know full well they'd be ostracized by their teammates as being weak.

And they're adults too.

that's too darn bad...peer pressure is a bitch.

adults usually don't pick on other adults with serious issues. if they were 16 year old kids i'd probably get behind your rationale.

When PJ Stock suggests that, while yes he was strangled to death, it was accidental, is he implying auto-erotic asphyxiation or am I reading too far into this?

Link posted as soon as I dig it up.

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mechaphil