That's not an option for me either. There isn't reliable public transportation where I live.

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you know this tax would encourage the development of public transportation, right?

fuck i wish the government would tax us to get this high speed rail off the ground.

heres a question for everyone. do you guys like the buffalo bills? do you want them to move? if not, you would likely support the increase of taxes to pay for a stadium, correct? but you flip shit over stuff that actually matters? priorities.

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Oh yeah... that's great. Pay more to use your car, or pay to use public transportation to avoid the tax. Stellar.

Do you really believe that high speed rail is efficient? Don't you think that if high speed rail was something the majority of people would use on a regular basis, that the private rail companies would have invested in them already? It's not practical for us, except in the areas that Amtrak has already invested in.

Point is, you're complacency with the government taking more of your hard earned money is ridiculous, and frankly, borderline reckless.

I'd love to see our infrastructure improved, and it can be done without taxing us. They need to get their shit together and cut the inefficiencies, and use THAT money instead.

You're also not reading this bill correctly. They wouldn't be using this money to do some radical drastic improvements. This is just to keep up with the drop in revenue they're getting from gas taxes! So even with the institution of this tax, you aren't going to see any radical changes.

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Wheelhouse

you must not drive michigan roads much. yeah, they need to raise our taxes. and if the government has this much invested in our road system with the raising of this tax, then they will certainly encourage and support more mass transportation. in fact, my old city voted to raise taxes to double the rapid (grand rapids bus mass transit) AND they are discussing a subway system from the north side of downtown to the south side, and east to west. id vote for that too.

to put it lightly, i embrace this tax fully. or a raise in the gas tax. or even both, as this countries infrastructure needs it badly. you want these luxuries, but you think paying for them is outlandish.

and yes, high speed rail is practical. alot of countries use this mode of transportation to the max. they are doing high speed rail tests here. i hope it comes into fruition.

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Public transportation needed to be built when the cities were first started. Well moreso subway systems.

NYC and Chicago have great subway systems, hardly any other city can offer that or even build that because of how hard it would be to do now.

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chicago doesnt have a subway.

public transportation can come in many many forms. raised rail, raised high speed rail, taxis, busses, ferries....

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Above ground Train stuff, close enough.

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chicagos mass transit is wonderful, in addition to the L that you talk about (the above ground train stuff) they also have light rail ways called the metra that link the suburbs to the city. ride the metra to a station, get off, and ride the L. its awesome.

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Exactly. Plus, you know, people are actually PAYING FOR SERVICES THEY RECEIVE that aren't free when they pay taxes. Plus, you know, there is a little thing called air quality and another little thing called global warming to worry about. I'm all for carbon taxes.

Sure they can, as long as they get federal approval. It's happening here in Virginia on I-95.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/va-can-move-ahead-with-i-95-tolling-plan-feds-say/2011/09/19/gIQAaRELgK_story.html

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i didnt know that. thank you!

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No problem. Don't get me started on the HOT lanes tho

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the fucks a hot lane?

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HOT lanes are "High Occupancy Toll" lanes. Currently in Northern Va (down the middle of 95) are High Occupancy Vehicle lanes. A highway in the middle of a highway for those vehicles that have 3+ inside. Well, the state didn't expand them south 10-12 years ago when they had the money so they decided to make the HOV lanes toll lanes for those who have less than 3 in the vehicle.

The problem I have with this is that it's a public/private partnership with a company from outside the US so it's not helping our economy. The other issue I have is current the HOV lanes are open to all vehicle during non-peak times. With the new HOT lanes, no matter what time of the day it is we'll have to pay a toll. Tolls have been estimated as 20 cents a mile non-peak and up to more than a dollar a mile during peak times. Most of which will go to Australia.

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I DON'T want these luxuries. I don't need them. Right now, my main concerns in this country aren't about having an extra lane on my local highway, or a smoother ride to work.

There are millions of American families that are currently struggling just to put food on the table for their kids because they're jobless. And you, right now, are advocating a raise in their taxes.

How exactly do you think drastic improvements in our infrastructure is going to help Americans at this present time? I know you're next argument is going to be about the jobs that this tax would create. But guess what?

They'll be laid off in less than two years, and their taxes will be higher once it's over because the government's going to have to cover the deficits they accumulated while paying these road workers.

Meanwhile, NONE of this spending or taxes will have done ANYTHING to help improve the economy.

High speed rail would be a great luxury for me to be able to get to Buffalo faster for Sabres games. I'd love it. But guess what? I'm not in a financial position for my taxes to be raised for one, and if the cost is too great for Amtrak to make it happen sustainably with their passenger fares, it's not economically viable. That's why it hasn't been done in NY yet, and that's why it's facing delays in California.

Someday, we should be able to afford the improvements we want in our infrastructure. But not now. Not when we're facing a $15,000,000,000,000 national debt, and a $1,500,000,000,000 deficit in 2011 alone.

It's time to end our militarism, balance the budget, lower individual and corporate taxes to promote job creation and bring manufacturing jobs back to the states, and start chipping away at our ridiculously large debt.

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Wheelhouse

Just wow. I'm glad you're passionate about politics, but it seems you're living in "the bubble". Let me explain:

The 'luxury' you speak of, the Buffalo Bills, brings in far more tax revenue than we ever put into it. If we don't pony up for them to stay, it will cost us far more in the end. If you were ignoring the Bills part of his post, I apologize.

As for your 'smooth road' policy, this infrastructure work HAS TO BE DONE SOMETIME. It's not repaving good roads, as you'd like to imply, but it's fixing things in poor condition. As Obama said, it won't be paid for by raising taxes on the starving families(as you implied), but rather by repealing the tax breaks given by the Bush adm. The road workers will then take that money, and SPEND IT INTO OUR ECONOMY. Something that WASN'T happening from the tax cuts for the rich. Would you prefer we continue to give them tax breaks so they can either stash the money away, or even better yet invest it overseas on cheap labor????? All economies begin with their infrastructure, so dismissing this as no way to better the economy is foolish.

You want lower taxes on corporations and individuals to spur growth?? Well, in a fantasy world, it works, but in the global economy we'd have to be the Dollar General, and give things away. Do you really think we can compete with China in manufacturing by lowering corporate tax rates???? Really?? So you want the government to subsidize business to the point of pennies on the hour for the average worker?? Why not just give the rich EVERYTHING, and we can all be slaves with jobs. The only solution is the FAIR solution. Everyone gets a fair wage, and pays a fair tax burden. 30 years ago this was considered the norm. Now, we have funneled all the money into the 1%, and they took that money, and their business elsewhere. Where was regulation(doesn't sound like such a bad word when used in this context) when we needed it. Ask the Republicans(and free trade backers). While your at it, ask them why they don't worry about extending the payroll credit for low income families, but INSIST on the extension of Bush era credits????? These people ruined our country, and now want to drain the lifeless corpse of any remaining blood. All so they can someday join the ranks of their contributors in corporate America. While it's sad, it's even sadder that WE LET THEM DO IT right under our noses by "living in the bubble".

Edit: I also would like to add that many of these (1 million)workers will be coming off unemployment. Sure, this is not a "fix", but it WILL help some people. Hey, it's better than paying the members of the Republican house 500k/year to vote 'NO' on everything to try to make the president look bad, isn't it??

Thank you, Daz. Very good post!

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This time, like all times, is a very good one, if we but know what to do with it.
--Emerson

I was ignoring the Bills part. I wouldn't blame anyone who lived in Buffalo for accepting a LOCAL tax increase to keep their professional team in town. That's different from Federal taxation like this proposed legislation for infrastructure.



You're incorrect. The tax that's been proposed as you'll see in my in my first post is a tax on every car in America based on its milage. The government would put a device that transmits the milage data to the IRS so they know how much to tax you.



You think a laborer who takes on a job that'll last for 2 years is going to use his money for discretionary spending without knowing whether or not he's going to have a job after the project is over? Absolutely not. He's going to stash it away.

And who's money is he receiving from the government? His own. And then when he goes out and spends that money, he gets taxed on it, AGAIN. That's not a winning formula for American laborers.



You're wrong again there. Some of the greatest years for our economy came in the mid 2000's thanks to the Bush era tax cuts. Here's a real life example.

I work in the boating industry, at a dealer in sales. The 2000's were some of the best years in HISTORY for boat sales thanks to the Bush era tax cuts. My father's dealership was employing 45 people locally at that time. Full benefits, above minimum wage, even for prepping jobs. Additionally, thanks to all the local sales, we collected THOUSANDS of dollars in sales tax revenue for Warren county.

But this didn't just happen on our local level. This was nation wide. You know who else this benefitted? The 3,000+ people employed in Neodesha, Kansas building boats, and the truck drivers all across America delivering them to the dealerships.

That's your proof right there that lowering taxes spurs growth. And just so you know, the Bush era tax cuts weren't just for rich people. Those tax cuts lowered taxes for the poor and middle class as well.

The collapse in 2009 has nothing to do with these tax cuts, either. The primary culprit in that event was the collapse of the housing market, which again the liberals are to blame for forcing lending companies to offer subprime mortgages to people with poor credit. But that discussion is for another time.

The best way to fix things now is to lower taxes again and cut government spending so the stock market isn't so uneasy and the retirement portfolios of average Americans quit getting killed.



We're not far off from having low enough tax rates to bring manufacturing jobs back to America. There are tons of foreign auto companies who have invested in American manufacturing in the past two years. Volkswagen just built a state of the art plant in Chattanooga and they are employing 2500 people and it's going to grow larger.

Why are rich Americans hanging onto their money now? It's because they see the government running this country into the ground. We're in constant war, we have a 1.5 TRILLION dollar deficit, and no one in congress is willing to cut anything. If we continue on this path, the US dollar is going to collapse, and the cost of living is going to drastically increase.

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Wheelhouse

Oh boy, here we go!

You mean this DRAFT of an UNDATED bill is what he proposed to pay for the infrastructure bill. Not sure how you made that stretch, haha. “This is not an administration proposal," Sorry, gonna have to cry talking out your ass here. http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/h ... y-the-mile

So only "discretionary spending" helps the economy?? Really?? So you think this unemployed guy is going to stash the money away??? For how long?? He was unemployed, remember?? As for him paying taxes on his wages, he won't pay hardly anything, in fact federal income tax will HELP him if he has kids. So the REALITY is he gets a job for two years, files a federal tax form and gets back probably MORE than he paid in, and it's paid for by people who could blow their noses with $100 bills, and it wouldn't hure them. Problem, you say?????????? I don't see a problem.

Those retirement portfolios took a big hit THE MINUTE Bush went into office for the "booming 00's". Not to totally discredit your boating industry profile, but that's certainly not enough to prove to me or anyone we were high on the hog until Obama took over, because that's what you're implying. The same deficits you're crying about are THE SAME ONES THAT WERE CREATED DURING YOUR SUPPOSED BOOM created by the tax credits. Coincidence??? Let me make this simple. You, me and Thomas Vanek all put in $5/year to pay our taxes. Say we give Vanek a credit of $2, and then we fall short of paying our taxes by $2. It doesn't take a scholar to figure out why Vanek now has a boat, and yet we're short, does it??

Well, I'm glad you know what the rich are doing with their money. I was figuring they were investing it in other countries. It's a real relief to know they're holding onto it until the U.S. gives them a fighting chance to make some REAL money. I mean $50 billion in profits is hardly worth their time/effort right now, is it?? What's wrong with FAIR tax rates, anyways? Why do they have to be low?? As much as you'd hate to admit it, we NEED a government. That government isn't free. If you want, we can make corporate tax rates 0%, and then just tax the people at whatever rate it takes, but that'll drive up wages, which the company will have to pay ANYWAYS. See the inherent problem here. Taxes are necessary, AND they have to be paid. 2 facts of life. Saying lower taxes is better, is a fools game. It's all politics, because it HAS to come from somewhere.

As for the deficit, which you seem to think is the REAL problem. Well, we have to solve that like REAL people would. If it were a person's debt, you figure out WHY IT HAPPENED(so you don't do it again), and then gain additional income(aka tax revenues) to pay it off. I think we all know why it happened. The great de-regulator theory proved you can't let banks operate any old way they like, so the next asshole candidate that says de-regulation should clearly be shot. The other reason is the "have a beer with him" presidential theory. The Iraq war was money we couldn't afford to spend, and we did it anyways. I suppose we should have ripped up that fuktards credit card, but we had no way to do so. I guess the lesson learned there is to vote for a president who isn't stupid.

Before anyone wants to beat dead horses splitting hairs over who voted for what war, or who oversaw what committee, don't bother. I have no intention of playing the blame game. I just wanted to break a few bubbles is all.

b0osh!

well said. it seems alot of people embrace this new tax with open arms.

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