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Godzilla1960
PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 4:12 pm 
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I don't disagree with the premise of the OP, but did you still feel the same way on December 9th, after Miller stopped 35 shots and we shutout the vaunted Washington offense 3-0?

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icehound
PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 4:37 pm 
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fan4life61 wrote:
rbochan wrote:
I reiterate:
After what he said about Ruff in the press, does anyone seriously think he'd sign with Buffalo?


what did he say?


"Max looks like he got a second life," Kovalchuk said. "In Buffalo, he took a beating by the coach. He’s one of the hardest workers. Every day, he’s smiling." -Yahoo Sports


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jordano
PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 5:05 pm 
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Well if you play alongside Kovalchuk or any other top player in the league you're obviously going to put up points. I'm proud of Afinoflagawana but it's not like we didn't see this coming.

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slesh
PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 6:11 pm 
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Godzilla1960 wrote:
I don't disagree with the premise of the OP, but did you still feel the same way on December 9th, after Miller stopped 35 shots and we shutout the vaunted Washington offense 3-0?

I have been posting on this since before the middle of last season Godzilla. I touted Connolly to be gone at the deadline last season. I have seen this coming for 3 years now. Pitt and Wash. have built well enough to own the conference for a number of years to come. If we want to keep pace and be a real contender, the moves have to be made.

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sabresEH
PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 8:52 pm 
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slesh wrote:
Well, take a good look at that game last night folks. Some of you wanted to know what offensive can do for you...............there is your answer.
The Washington Capitals are an Offensive Jaugernaght, plain and simple. They smoked our system, they smoked our defense, they smoked our goalie. Mistakes cost the Sabres this game and we all know it. But let me ask you this:

Having the knowledge that we will have to compete with a team like the Capitals for the Cup, would you not want Kovalchuck and another guy brought in to help give you that offensive boost?

This game is a case study not only on the why's Buffalo needs offensive firepower, but it also gives you the answer to just what kind of fire power we need. Get used to looking at that scene from last night folks, because come playoff time, thats the hard-charging, fast skating, tape to tape passing and dynamic scoring Washington Capitals that are going to show up in the playoffs.

Has the reality of the situation sunk in yet. Be afraid, be very afraid. There is no way on earth the Buffalo Sabres shutdown the Washington Capitals in the playoffs, just way to much firepower.
Lets hope Darcy and the organization get busy on making the necessary moves to elevate the output of Buffalo's Offense.

So u don't think Miller is gonna be on top of his game come playoffs if we make it. If our top 6 are moving their feet and all 18 skaters are playing within the system, than we can take Washington in a 7 game series. Honestly I've been waiting for Miller to have an off game. Last nights game was bound to happen. Remember in 06-07 when we were the team with the offensive fire-power. Without a good team defence you will not succeed. Washington's defence isn't good enough. Nor is their goaltending.

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bigC24
PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 9:09 pm 
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Godzilla1960 wrote:
I don't disagree with the premise of the OP, but did you still feel the same way on December 9th, after Miller stopped 35 shots and we shutout the vaunted Washington offense 3-0?

Exactly my thoughts.


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Toddmh
PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2009 11:02 pm 
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icehound wrote:
fan4life61 wrote:
rbochan wrote:
I reiterate:
After what he said about Ruff in the press, does anyone seriously think he'd sign with Buffalo?


what did he say?


"Max looks like he got a second life," Kovalchuk said. "In Buffalo, he took a beating by the coach. He’s one of the hardest workers. Every day, he’s smiling." -Yahoo Sports



well I kinda agree with Kovalchuk on this one,max was in Ruff's dog house for a couple years..It did either of them no good..I like max,glad to see him do well..


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PuckSniperPensel
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:12 am 
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slesh wrote:
Well, take a good look at that game last night folks. Some of you wanted to know what offensive can do for you...............there is your answer.
The Washington Capitals are an Offensive Jaugernaght, plain and simple. They smoked our system, they smoked our defense, they smoked our goalie. Mistakes cost the Sabres this game and we all know it. But let me ask you this:

Having the knowledge that we will have to compete with a team like the Capitals for the Cup, would you not want Kovalchuck and another guy brought in to help give you that offensive boost?

This game is a case study not only on the why's Buffalo needs offensive firepower, but it also gives you the answer to just what kind of fire power we need. Get used to looking at that scene from last night folks, because come playoff time, thats the hard-charging, fast skating, tape to tape passing and dynamic scoring Washington Capitals that are going to show up in the playoffs.

Has the reality of the situation sunk in yet. Be afraid, be very afraid. There is no way on earth the Buffalo Sabres shutdown the Washington Capitals in the playoffs, just way to much firepower.
Lets hope Darcy and the organization get busy on making the necessary moves to elevate the output of Buffalo's Offense.


I'm not afraid.

But I won't go there.

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Los9090
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 1:27 pm 
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jvaccaro6 wrote:
Kovy will never, EVER, EVER wear a Sabres uniform. How do we aquire him while only having 1.4M in cap space? We're not the Rangers, we can't make the cap just go away :P

The Rangers still have to spend to the cap like everyone else though

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Squanto
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 3:04 pm 
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The difference is that the Rangers can clear cap space in a snap, unlike other teams.


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CriminallyVu1gar
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 5:38 pm 
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Kovie doesn't play defense. What's he -8? No thanks.

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slesh
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 7:26 pm 
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CriminallyVu1gar wrote:
Kovie doesn't play defense. What's he -8? No thanks.

Lets do a multi-question answer here Criminal.

1. Kovy achieves the same numbers as any 2 offensive Buffalo players, true or false? TRUE!
2. Kovy, as a truly skilled hockey player, actually increases or inflats the level of his linemates, true or false? TRUE!
3. The Buffalo Sabres have a real chance at the cup with the current roster? FALSE!
4. Scoring line 1 could look like the following with the right moves from management:
Ilya Kovalchuck (LW) - Eric Staal (C) - Pomminville/Stafford or an AHL prospect or another option.
The situation with the top 6 isn't going to change. 10 games = a funk, 35 games = the norm.

Get used to reality, moves need to be made. Make your voice heard for god's sake. Speak out about the lack of offensive firepower. Don't let Millers skills go to waste the way Hasek's did in the 98-99 season. SPEAK UP NOW PEOPLE, LETS GET THE CHANGES WE NEED TO MAKE A RUN AT THE CUP.

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Dreakon
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 8:07 pm 
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slesh wrote:
4. Scoring line 1 could look like the following with the right moves from management:
Ilya Kovalchuck (LW) - Eric Staal (C) - Pomminville/Stafford or an AHL prospect or another option.
The situation with the top 6 isn't going to change. 10 games = a funk, 35 games = the norm.

Get used to reality, moves need to be made.

How ironic. The guy that thinks acquiring Kovalchuck and Staal could happen, is the same guy telling everyone to "get used to reality".

Even if management went out and actively tried to find guys to boost scoring a bit... we would never, ever get Kovalchuk... and probably wouldn't be able to get Staal without giving up more than a couple underachieving forwards. And do we really want to have to throw draft picks into the mix or get rid of a couple of our better, solid D men and/or prospects for it?

Plus, you have to realize that Ruff's system is to have everyone playing a defensive game. Even if we brought in a Kovalchuk or a Staal, I guarantee we wouldn't see a huge surge in offense (of course we'd see some better numbers, but probably not significant enough to warrant what we'd have to give up for them). Odds are, if the player were stubborn and didn't follow the "system" to squeeze some more offense and a few more points out... it would just turn into another Max situation, where he tries to be a one man offensive crew and end up just turning the puck over. No matter how talented a player is, he can't be the only guy on the ice playing an offensive game. Is it really any surprise to see Max flourishing in the less rigid, offensive style of Kovie and Atlanta?

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slesh
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 8:41 pm 
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Dreakon wrote:
slesh wrote:
4. Scoring line 1 could look like the following with the right moves from management:
Ilya Kovalchuck (LW) - Eric Staal (C) - Pomminville/Stafford or an AHL prospect or another option.
The situation with the top 6 isn't going to change. 10 games = a funk, 35 games = the norm.

Get used to reality, moves need to be made.

How ironic. The guy that thinks acquiring Kovalchuck and Staal could happen, is the same guy telling everyone to "get used to reality".

Even if management went out and actively tried to find guys to boost scoring a bit... we would never, ever get Kovalchuk... and probably wouldn't be able to get Staal without giving up more than a couple underachieving forwards. And do we really want to have to throw draft picks into the mix or get rid of a couple of our better, solid D men and/or prospects for it?

Plus, you have to realize that Ruff's system is to have everyone playing a defensive game. Even if we brought in a Kovalchuk or a Staal, I guarantee we wouldn't see a huge surge in offense (of course we'd see some better numbers, but probably not significant enough to warrant what we'd have to give up for them). Odds are, if the player were stubborn and didn't follow the "system" to squeeze some more offense and a few more points out... it would just turn into another Max situation, where he tries to be a one man offensive crew and end up just turning the puck over. No matter how talented a player is, he can't be the only guy on the ice playing an offensive game. Is it really any surprise to see Max flourishing in the less rigid, offensive style of Kovie and Atlanta?

Ok, I've about had enough.
Lets speak reality. Please, lets do so.

1. No scoring = no Stanley Cup
2. Miller, although has come on strong, is an unproven commodity, don't take my word for it, look at his career stats. Which would lead to anyone with common sense to believe that to succeed, ride him now, not 3 years from now. But hey, ya'll know best, my possible 39 years of watching hockey accounts for 0. (even though I called for the Sabres failure in 98-99 even with Hasek).
3. A good defense is a good offense. (Need I say more on this). Enough of the defending of this team. Come on now, changes need to happen. 10 games, I say maybe. 35 games in, I say "MAKE THE DARN CHANGES ALREADY".
4. Game changing players: If anyone actually believes we have a game changing player on our roster, I point you to the Pitt and Wash. games. Lets not forget the Ottawa situation that is ongoing with the Sabres. You want a Stanley Cup Banner overhead? Then be big enough to admit when and what changes you feel need be made, don't cowar and hide behind numbers. Look at the reality of the situation and attempt to offer real change, yet reasonable change. Kovalchuck, no matter how unlikely, can be had.

As I've stated time and time again, stop playing the "oh, i'm the best fan of the team" role, and start thinking realistically on talent available, money available and the balls of management to make the necessary changes to make a "REAL RUN AT THE CUP".

I mean, come on now, this isn't about making the playoffs, this is about winning it all. Open your eyes people, see what is going on around the league.

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Dreakon
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 8:57 pm 
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slesh wrote:
But hey, ya'll know best, my possible 39 years of watching hockey accounts for 0.

If you honestly think we can get Kovalchuk or Staal without completely decimating what strengths this team has, then I really think it does account for zero, zip, nadda, nothing. Do you really think we would be able to get these "face of the franchise" players by giving out our underachieving top 6, an unproven prospect and a draft pick? Especially within the conference? Hell no! We'd be giving out players like Myers and Miller. This team can't afford to give them out, even if we get a Kovalchuk in return.

And if you actually think that bringing offensive minded players onto a team with a coach that has spent the last two or so years trying to hammer the idea of defensive play into this teams skull will make us an offensive juggernaut, you're also terribly mistaken. Since losing Drury and Briere, we've done nothing but try to build a solid defensive team around MILLER. Injecting solid, gritty, hardworking players like Grier, Rivet, Kaleta, Montador and Ellis. Dumping defensive liabilities like Max and Peters.

Now if you can get your head out of your ass and listen for a second, I'm not saying we shouldn't make any moves to improve our offense. You're just barking up the wrong tree trying to get guys that are practically unachievable and that wouldn't fit in Ruff's system whatsoever like Kovalchuk. If you want to go after guys we could never get, look at players like Zach Parise who are young, immensely talented and used to playing (and succeeding) on a defensively minded team.

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Squanto
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 9:56 pm 
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"SPEAK UP PEOPLE"?

Really?

You can yell and scream and hoot and holler ALL YOU WANT. You may THINK you know more about how to build an NHL franchise, but the fact of the matter is that Darcy Regier is an an NHL GM, and you're not. No matter what you may think, he doesn't give two shits about what anyone else thinks he should do.

Now, this is not to say that we don't have the right to state our opinions. We all do that on these boards all the time. But, our opinions are like assholes; everyone has one, and most of em stink.

With all due respect slesh, you arguments always seem to be predicated on two points:
1. You've been watching the team for a long time. (The clear connotation is that you feel you KNOW more than others, and your opinion should carry more weight.)
2. You've 'predicted' previous failures. (Again, the connotation is that you're a hockey savant, and people should assume you know best.)

Well, both are crap. The "I've been watching longer than you" argument? Take that to the WGR whiner line or the Buffalo News comments section. It doesn't make your ideas any better or worse than others.

Your 'predictions'? Whatever. It's easy to predict failure for a team that's never won a championship. Maintaining a constantly negative attitude towards the team and bragging that you 'called' their failure is pretty damn easy. You know what would have been an impressive prediction? Calling that they would make the ECF BEFORE the 05-06 season STARTED.

I see the same thing setting up now. You've been yelling it up about how this team doesn't have enough to win... yet they're 1st in their division, and 3r in the conference just shy of the halfway point The 'hot start, then collapse' routine kinda goes out the window when they're this far in. Is the team flawed? Sure they are, every team is. They can improve the consistency of their play, and they can improve some of their personnel through trades if such a trade is out there.

However, this assumption that they are going to collapse in the playoffs because they don't have one of the most electric scorers in the world is ABSURD. The last two seasons, if they went into a scoring slump, they lost games. Chunks of them. This team hasn't been scoring at a good clip at all.... yet they're still winning 2 out of every 3 games.

Take them for what they are; a defense first team. They can, and do, win that way.


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Howie Hodge
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:19 pm 
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I'll write any comments less than glowing about Gil Perreault off as coming from someone who came along well after Perreault played. There are many players who, based on career points, rate higher than Gil perrealt, but in fact couldn't carry his jock as a player.

Ron Francis, Stan Makita, Mark Recchi, Adam Oates, Johnny Bucyk, Doug Gilmour, Dave Andreychuk, Pierre Turgeon????

Perreault was severely hurt by not playing with better players than he did the second half of his career. He would have put up another 300 - 400 points; and he played a few hundred games less than many above him on the list.

Two Canada Cups he was as good as any player in the world, if not better.

As far as lists, Bobby Hull is not in the top 25; and you can't rationally tell me Bobby Hull wasn't one of the all time greats - top 10 easy. That is unless you never saw them play. Similarely, I can't argue that players like Syl Apps, Milt Schmidt, and Joe Malone weren't among the top handful of all time NHL players, because statistically they're nowhere's near that. I never saw them play, had I ; I may feel differently.

Not to get off tangent; but Perreault was better than many people realize, and I doubt many who witnessed him would argue otherwise.

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Bauter88
PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:33 pm 
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you can shut down any team in the Nhl if they dont score goals.. Miller doesnt allow many goals.. you remember that last time miller played the caps before this? miller shut out that OFFENSIVE JUGGERNAUT of team.. Last game was bad.. thats all thats needed to be said.

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Sabresfansince1980
PostPosted: Sat Dec 26, 2009 10:28 am 
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Along with Kovalchuk I'd like a beach house on the Florida coast, a BMW M-6, two Playboy bunnies, and an invisible flying suit.

I mean, since we're talking unrealistic fantasies and stuff...


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sabresrocker56
PostPosted: Sat Dec 26, 2009 1:21 pm 
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Why is it every time this team loses people call for Darcy to blow up the roster?
We are NEVER getting Kovalchuk, deal with it. Roy is currently our leading point scorer, so why trade him? Myers is going to (or should) stay for a very long time, hopefully he can become our Nick Lidstrom. Miller is going to retire as a Sabre.
Do you even look at the standings, or just say "I've watched hockey for ages, therefore I can tell this team is going to fail." We are 3rd in the conference (just 6 points behind that mighty offensive juggernaut that is Washington) and 1st in our division with 4 points on an unstable Bruins team. The Sabres have done exactly what Pittsburgh and Washington have done, build through the draft. However, Pittsburgh and Washington just sucked enough to get high draft picks, we got mid-level ones. But now doesn't everything seem in place? Our lineup, which is currently winning games, is mostly made up of our draft picks. Vanek, Roy, Pominville, MacArthur, Gaustad, Kaleta, Kennedy, Tallinder, Myers, Miller, Gerbe. All of them were drafted by the Sabres and all are currently helping this team win. Now, people are calling to blow up this winning line up to get one player who is going to be a UFA next year and will probably resign elsewhere. Need I remind you this same line up not only defeated the Capitals, but they also shut them out. The fact of the matter is that the Sabres came out totally flat in the first period on Wednesday and the Capitals took advantage. That is going to happen from time to time. There are 82 games in a season, they're not going to win every one and their not going to look stellar in all of them. Also, how is it that this high flying Capitals team was defeated in the Conference Semis last year? (getting blown out 6-2 in game 7) If they are so offensive where was it there? When you play the Capitals, if you shut down Ovechkin, it's almost a guaranteed win. Ovechkin's line came out fast early and got a goal. Had he effectively been shut down, however, that Backstrom goal would have never happened.

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NYIntensity wrote:
Sabres2Sabres wrote:
If Miller and Myers were playing like they did last year, we'd probably be over 500 right now.

If I had decided to jerk off instead, I probably wouldn't be paying child support...


"Grier coming in over the line. He leaves it to Gaustad. The shot. THEY SCOOOREE!! RING UP ANOTHER ONE FOR THE GOOSE!!! HONK IF YA HEAR THE GOOSE!! 3-0 BUFFALO!"


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