Godzilla1960 wrote:
slesh wrote:
The Federal Government, to date, has never successfully established and run a fiscally sound entitlement program.
Let's just look at this year, okay?
"The government netted roughly $4 billion – the equivalent of a 15% annual return – from eight of the biggest banks that have fully repaid their obligations to the government..."
"...the U.S. Federal Reserve earned $16.4 billion through the first six months of the year, thanks to a range of rescue programs – including loans to investment banks and purchases of mortgage-backed securities – while the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. (FDIC) saw a profit of more than $7 billion on the fees it charged through a program that guaranteed debt issued by banks." http://www.stockmarketsreview.com/news/ ... _20090901/I'm not an economist, but that looks pretty fiscally sound to me.Godzilla, this is not an entitlement program.
This was a straight out loan package from the taxpayers to the financial industry. I deal with financial firms all day every day, believe me when I tell you the Bush TARP plan and the Obama Stimulus packages were and still are very high risk to the taxpayer.
There is no such thing as "To Big To Fail"!!!
None of these programs were necessary, you really need to understand the corrections that need to take place within this industry.
If the Taxpayer had not bailed out these firms would the collapse have been much worse? Absolutely, but now, because of the bailouts, the system will not be corrected for years to come, all that has been accomplished is a prolonging of the natural state of the free market system. I truly hope you don't believe this nation is out of hot water, by instituting programs such as this, the government has opened the door to further spending. Bailouts cannot be selective, understand this, what the government does for one, it most atleast look into doing for others.
Can you hear that sound? Thats the printing presses at the 12 Reserve Banks that make up the Federal Reserve (nothing Federal about it by the way). Ya, thats the American dollar being devalued beyond your wildest comprehension. You think allowing these institutions to fail would have been bad, wait for the catastrophic callopse of the dollar due to inflation, it'll make these bailouts look like childs play.
You don't think it can happen? Guys like Peter Schiff and Steven Forbes saw the rise in value in precious metals specifically due to this. There is plenty of information out there for you to review, but the bottom line is, TARP and the Stimulus package are bad news all day long. Atleast the clean up from this would have been a much shorter time frame.
You should really read the following legislation:
Glass–Steagall ActThe Banking Act of 1933 was a law that established the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC) in the United States and introduced banking reforms, some of which were designed to control speculation[1]. It is most commonly known as the Glass–Steagall Act, after its legislative sponsors, Carter Glass and Henry B. Steagall.
Gramm–Leach–Bliley ActSome provisions of the Banking Act of 1933, such as Regulation Q, which allowed the Federal Reserve to regulate interest rates in savings accounts, were repealed by the Depository Institutions Deregulation and Monetary Control Act of 1980.
Provisions that prohibit a bank holding company from owning other financial companies were repealed on November 12, 1999, by the Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act.By the way, neither piece of legislation was would have been necessary, but oops, the Federal Government decided to pass the Federal Reserve Act, for your reading pleasure:
The Federal Reserve ActThe plan adopted in the original Federal Reserve Act called for the creation of a System that contained both private and public entities. There were to be at least eight, and no more than 12, private regional Federal reserve banks (12 were established) each with its own branches, board of directors and district boundaries (Sections 2, 3, and 4) and the System was to be headed by a seven member Federal Reserve Board made up of public officials appointed by the President (strengthened and renamed in 1935 as the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System with the Secretary of the Treasury and the Comptroller of the Currency dropped from the Board - Section 10). Also created as part of the Federal Reserve System was a 12 member Federal Advisory Committee (Section 12) and a single new United States currency, the Federal Reserve Note (Section 16).
Congress decided in the Federal Reserve Act that all nationally chartered banks were required to become members of the Federal Reserve System. It requires them to purchase specified non-transferable stock in their regional Federal reserve bank and to set aside a stipulated amount of non-interest bearing reserves with their respective reserve bank (since 1980 all depository institutions have been required to set aside reserves with the Federal Reserve and be entitled to certain Federal Reserve services - Sections 2 and 19). State chartered banks have the option of becoming members of the Federal Reserve System and to thus be supervised, in part, by the Federal Reserve (Section 9). Member banks are entitled to have access to discounted loans at the discount window in their respective reserve bank, to a 6% annual dividend in their Federal reserve stock and to other services (Sections 13 and 7). The Act also permits Federal reserve banks to act as fiscal agents for the United States government (Section 15).
Here is the criticism and direct corallation to collapses and the afore mentioned legislation:Controversy about the Federal Reserve Act and the establishment of the Federal Reserve System have existed since prior to its passage, and include whether Congress has the Constitutional power to delegate its power to coin money or issue paper money, whether the Federal Reserve is a private banking cartel established to protect large banks,
or whether the Federal Reserves' actions increase the frequency and severity of boom-bust economic cycles such as the Great Depression of the 1930s, the Late-2000s recession, and others.Here is some interesting reads for you as well.The Federal Reserve System (colloquially, "the Fed") has faced various criticisms since its conception in 1913. The system was created as a third attempt at central banking in the United States. The Federal Reserve Act, which began the Fed, was a hotly debated issue in its own right, and passed primarily on party lines—and that was only after considerable political manipulation of Congressmen by Woodrow Wilson.[1]
The earliest debates on central banking in the United States centered on its constitutionality, private ownership, and the degree to which an economy should be centrally planned. Some of the most prominent early critics were Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, and Andrew Jackson, although Madison ultimately recanted. As the effects of central banking, and the Federal Reserve System in particular, became more apparent, new criticisms began to emerge.
You can read the historical footnotes and factual based accounts of why this act was passed, who was championing it and what Woodrow Wilson said after signing it into law,
"all very interesting and telling facts and accounts behing who wanted this done and for what reasons".
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