It is time to take a good hard look at Derek Roy. This team needs heart, and I don't really think Derek Roy shows it. You can look at our roster top to bottom and pick out guys that give effort, or have shown what they're willing to sacrifice for the team.
Connolly went after Gomez last year, Stafford has fought a couple times. Grier's, Mairs, Ellis's, Kaleta's, Kennedy's efforts all go without saying.
But Roy, man, I watch him and I never really say, gee that guy is really busting his butt for us.
I think they need to get a few front line players that are also vet leaders that will get Roy back to the role he was in with Briere and Drury were ahead of him.
_________________ Sabres Hockey: Commitment to Mediocrity
The problem stems back to Roy. His play is unpredictable this year. He dangles a ton, he shoots other times, he passes other times. He's not playing within the offensive system, he's doing it his way. Miller and Ruff both mentioned it last night. Guys do it their way, and cheat the system, and we don't convert on our chances.
Roy needs to play the system. But being "unpredictable" is not a bad thing. That's what scorers are supposed to be like. Is he going to pass? Is he going to shoot? If the defense doesn't know, they're going to give him some room to work.
That said, he can only play that way inside the offensive zone. He's got to keep making his passes in the neutral zone if the team is going to be successful, and that's his only fault.
That said, with the people he's been playing with, I really can't say I blame him. Vanek fucks things up almost every time he touches the puck. Hecht does alright, but he's only capable of catching a pass, crossing the red line, and dumping it in. Stafford is playing like the biggest pussy on the face of the earth.
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I'm sure in the offensive zone, there are cues as to what to do. Example being Roy has the high slot, and the two wingers have position low, one is supposed to crash the net, the other is to allow for an outlet. Roy then changes direction, and heads away from the slot, one wing is supposed to fill behind the net, while another allows as crossing opportunity. Then Roy again, dangles and changes direction, back to the Crash and outlet set up. Players are hurrying to get back to proper position, they get a pass, and aren't at an ideal shooting angle, then try to get creative, and boom, turn-over going the other way.
It's a matter of Roy having to simplify his game, to become more of a team player, rather than a creative player. Especially because he doesn't pass like a Crosby or Savard, nor does he shoot like an Iginla, Ovechkin, or Parise, and doesnt power his way to the net like a Langenbruner or a Getzlaf.
Those guys are prime examples of the best in the business at doing what they do. Roy isn't the best at anything, and needs to adapt his game to be a team game, much like a Thornton, Heatley, or St. Louis. He has the ability to be a great player, but he's got the head to be the next Max Afinogenov
I disagree with a lot of this. Lets review the highlights.
0:39 - Roy makes a nifty move to get around the outside, and throws a VERY SMART shot on goal - leg height, opposite side... perfect for a rebound, rather than ripping a wrist shot upstairs only to have it go into a chest or glove. Then look who fans on the rebound.
1:03 - Vanek breaks into the offensive zone, and tries to leave a drop pass for Roy instead of getting it deep. Roy had no chance to get to that puck, it's sent the other way, and Ovechkin gets a great opportunity to score. This is another example of Roy's wings making shitty plays.
Don't stop after Ovechkin makes his play. Stafford comes down the middle. Roy is wide open on the wing. Stafford fucks around and tries to pass like a little girl, and he surrenders the puck and it gets cleared out of the zone.
2:01 - Anther opportunity on offense, started with Kaleta, but Roy was again following the rules on the forecheck. One chases behind the goal, the other plays the wall so he can't send the puck around (Roy in this play) and the third crashes down the middle to cut off a pass.
The defenseman tries to send it around. Roy stops it, passes it to the slot for Mair, and it turns into a great chance. If he's playing with a winger who can actually score, that's a goal for Buffalo.
2:59 - Our one goal of the game, started and nearly ended with Roy folks. He gets the puck high on the wall, stickhandles until he gets pressured, and rips a wrist shot. Sure it goes wide, but when you shoot, you get either A. a goal, B. A faceoff in the zone, C. a rebound or D. a dump in.
In this case, the puck ends up as a dump in. Probably a good thing, because even if a rebound came out, look at Hecht and Pominville coasting. Somebody needs to drive hard to the fucking net. Again, that's the responsibility of the wingers.
Now, you all think that play by Washington was a give away and we got lucky, but Roy snuck in behind because he anticipated that drop pass. Look how it turned out. He finally gets a winger to finish.
4:36 - Roy corrals the puck in the neutral zone, and goes in 2 on 2 with Vanek. He leads the rush, and puts a little drop pass to Vanek.
Vanek should have shot, but instead he tries to go around and the play is broken up.
However, Vanek redeemed himself on this play (the only time he did something good this game) by going to the wall to corral the puck, and centers it to Butler.
Butler goes in for the shot, and look how's planted himself in front of the goal looking for a rebound; scrappy little Derek Roy. He dives to try to get the shot off, but gets stopped by the defenseman.
There are plenty of other examples that aren't shown in this video, like Roy's centering chip pass to Vanek that he ends up shooting over the goal.
I'm not just picking on you Jay, but I'm tired of hearing people bash on Roy. He's the best center we have. He improved his faceoffs big time this season, and he's the only player on the top six really earning his money on both ends of the ice.
You want to know why he doesn't pass? Because his team mates fucking suck and he knows it.
If he gets paired with Torres, the goals are going to come. Just you watch.
He's definitely breaking the rules of the system, and he needs to stick with it no matter how bad his team mates blow opportunities, but I understand his frustration when he's originally doing everything right, and the people around him are fucking it up.
Going to post that because I got in heavy about this with Jayvac in another thread, and I am absolutely positive that Derek Roy is not the problem here.
Not to mention, I've hear RJ say multiple times a game, "Broken up by Roy."
Fair enough. I wouldn't really argue that Roy does make plays, but I have a hard time seeing that 110% effort we all clamor for. Maybe it's just me.
He's a very small guy, and rightfully so, you aren't going to see him jump in and punch somebody.
That's not his job, and it's dangerous for small guys like him. Look what happened to Ennis on nothing but a cross check.
Guys like Stafford, Rivet, Montador, Gaustad, Grier, Ellis, Kaleta, Myers, Lydman... that's THEIR job. If they're failing to do so, we need to point to them, because that's partially what they're here for.
Tonight, pay very close attention to Roy's work in our own zone and on the back check. Specifically, watch how he starts the game. He'll be passing the puck to the wingers.
If they continuously screw it up like they did on Wednesday night, by the third period, you'll see Roy trying to do more by himself, unless he sticks to the plan, which I've said I agree that he needs to do. I just sympathize with his situation, because all that frustration stems from having wingers that can't get anything done right.
From the game highlights you analyzed, you're correct that Roy does have the ability to make plays.
However, there are many more plays not on the highlight reel that show him turning the puck over and playing the Max Afinogenov How Many Defenders Can I Beat Myself game.
From the game highlights you analyzed, you're correct that Roy does have the ability to make plays.
However, there are many more plays not on the highlight reel that show him turning the puck over and playing the Max Afinogenov How Many Defenders Can I Beat Myself game.
If I'm his winger, I'm pissed off by that too.
When you watch tonight, he'll play exactly the way he's supposed to from the first period right through the 2nd.
If things don't start going our way, that's when he'll act like super star Roy... but it's only because his wing pairings won't be doing shit.
And that's the sign of an immature player who wants it easy, doesn't want to work.
Look up and I said I agree he needs to stop doing that.
However, the original problem starts with the wingers. And when you look at the contracts of our top 6, Roy is not even close to being the first one to go.
You could bring Pavel Datsyuk in here, and the way Stafford, Pominville, and Vanek are playing, we would still have a shitty offense.
I agree with the statement Roy tries to do too much when things aren't going well. He needs to stick to simplified game more consistently. That's my only gripe about him. Also, Hecht does not belong on a line with Roy, he's become more of a third liner and plays well in that role with Grier and Kennedy.
_________________ Rest in Peace Nani. 10/3/10
Gerbacity
NYIntensity wrote:
Sabres2Sabres wrote:
If Miller and Myers were playing like they did last year, we'd probably be over 500 right now.
If I had decided to jerk off instead, I probably wouldn't be paying child support...
"Grier coming in over the line. He leaves it to Gaustad. The shot. THEY SCOOOREE!! RING UP ANOTHER ONE FOR THE GOOSE!!! HONK IF YA HEAR THE GOOSE!! 3-0 BUFFALO!"
Roy has the potential to be a great player. He's really good offensively, and really good defensively. But I agree that he needs to show more drive and heart. How the hell does he have an A on his chest? That's just sad.
I would be fine with trading him, but I'd also be fine with keeping him. I agree with what Jim Bob said, we need leaders on this team. Let Roy play, not be one of the big leaders on this team.
To be honest, I was down on Roy's play even when the team was winning regularly early in the year. He may be the best we have here now, I still feel like they could improve at the position.
I was all about Stafford being traded at the deadline. He's reached his potential, and isn't going to ever do anything more than he already has here.
To be honest, I was down on Roy's play even when the team was winning regularly early in the year. He may be the best we have here now, I still feel like they could improve at the position.
I was all about Stafford being traded at the deadline. He's reached his potential, and isn't going to ever do anything more than he already has here.
I'm not saying that we can't improve at center.
But when you look at the decisions of this organization in the past as to who to keep and who to let go, they've been very, very wrong.
We let JP Dumont leave, and we kept the fat in this organization instead.
If you move Roy, you better be damn sure that you're getting a better center in return.
Even if that does happen, however, you're still left with the same shitty wingers that aren't getting the job done.
I always thought Roy worked the hardest of anyone on the team at generating offense. No, he doesn't grind it out on the boards, but he's not that big of a guy. I think he skates hard and plays to his strengths. Yeah, he tries to do too much with the puck sometimes, but at least he's trying to find and create holes rather than simply slam the puck into the opposing goalie's chest every time. I think he's a really good #2 center, and his contract is among the best deals Darcy has ever made.
Anyway, this isn't Nintendo. Teams can't just make all the trades they want - sometimes you're stuck with what you've got.
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